UPNetwork  

Go Back   UPNetwork > Independent Forums > Fizzy Bubbles > FB Development

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-19-2017, 10:55 PM   #26
Maskerade
Boulder Badge
 
Maskerade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion Ette View Post
In the interim, perhaps allowing for one additional level to be purchased per week at the Daycare might be a possible, provisional, short-term solution. My thought is $300 for this additional charge while proposals are being worked on.
If it's something to be retracted later when another system is in place, maybe I'd prefer it isn't implemented to begin with. Not sure how paying more money to Daycare Couple helps my Pokemon grow stronger from an RP perspective (the stingy elders work harder if they're bribed? :P) As long as levels are awarded more generously where they should be, perhaps we don't need to tamper with the DC mechanics, especially not in a temporary fashion.
__________________
Maskerade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2017, 11:32 PM   #27
deoxys
こばやし だいすき~
 
deoxys's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 私の尾を食べてください OwO
Posts: 6,482
The thing is is that your proposal more or less is a Battle Frontier-lite. It does a few things slightly differently, but for the most part its focus and purpose were things the Battle Frontier was designed to cover, while also trying to keep people involved by actually RPing for their levels/rewards.

There is still a lot to be discussed in that area as it is still a WIP, but the goal of BF at its core was to give people interesting things to RP for levels without the storytelling that comes with a standard adventure.
deoxys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2017, 12:11 AM   #28
Maskerade
Boulder Badge
 
Maskerade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 210
Sure, like I said it's a 3-year-old idea, it's not meant to replace any of the ongoing discussion. As long as something functional is implemented, I'm on board
__________________
Maskerade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2017, 06:36 AM   #29
Marion Ette
The Light and the Shadow
 
Marion Ette's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Jirachi's Casino
Posts: 2,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maskerade View Post
Not sure how paying more money to Daycare Couple helps my Pokemon grow stronger from an RP perspective (the stingy elders work harder if they're bribed? :P)
My thought was that the Daycare would be hosting experts from the Battle Frontier who would be lending their coaching services to Pokémon in the couple's care whIle the BF is being built for an additional fee, or something to that effect.
__________________
Do you enjoy RP? If so, then join us at the UPN RPG Forum!
Marion Ette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2017, 07:11 AM   #30
Ex-Admiral Insane
Marsh Badge
 
Ex-Admiral Insane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Neverland
Posts: 1,558
Send a message via Skype™ to Ex-Admiral Insane
So one other problem a majority of you want to see fixed is the levelling system we have in FB. As of now it is considered to be too slow with most of the levels come from shops and candies rather than actual roleplaying. There’s no set idea put into place yet to fix this issue however. Below is a list of presented options I’ve come across, some of which are grouped together into one option. What I want to ask of you is to go over the list and pick out the options you think are worth trying, either singularly or in tandem with another option. Please provide more than one choice as we need to come with a solution that most people are comfortable with.
As always, if you have another solution that is not in this list then you’re free to mention it as an additional option. Please also respond to the list and choices provided by others in a respectable manner.

1) Increase levels given out in zones. For this one we need to communicate with the ZAs and ZUs and find a way to make this feasible. The other part of this option is that that we the mods set up a guideline for the updaters on the reward system and how much can be given out in a certain frequency.
2) Rare Candies become Zone-reply rewards. Perhaps that players can choose whether they want to get $250 or 1-2 Rare Candies for a Zone reply when claiming their rewards. Will be tricky though since we have two separate bank accounts that need to check with one another to ensure people aren’t claiming both rewards. Or, lower the $250 reward and give out a Rare Candy in addition to Pokédollars. This would also create the problem of making Rare Candies a currency once again.
3) Rare Candies can be purchased in the Department Store. Basically, this creates a method for Zone-reply Pokédollar rewards to be traded in for Rare Candies.
4) Make levels in Daycare purchasable. Same as above. Basically, this creates a method for Zone-reply Pokédollar rewards to be traded in for levels.
5) Trainer Battles are introduced. I definitely think trainer battles should be incorporated in FB in some manner as I do consider it to be a core mechanic of Pokémon. However, I want it to be an extra option we have available that’s simple – not an over-indulgent mechanic that dominates FB and turns it into a new ASB. Having this become a reliable way to earn levels might do exactly that.
6) Contests. Same as Trainer Battles almost.
7) Battle Frontier/Level-up Zone. Similar to battling but different that allows for more RPing. One problem mentioned is that updater resources (quite substantially) are diverted to this.
8) Create a new reward ladder of some sort that rewards players for reaching milestones. This vague idea came into mind after seeing Toyo’s “The Hub”. http://forums.upnetwork.net/showthread.php?t=4630 Basically, players keep track of certain statistics such as registered Pokémon or levels and get levels as reward for obtaining milestones. A bit of a meh idea honestly, but it’s an option nonetheless.
9) Increase levels in events. We have Halloween, Thanksgiving, FB Birthday, Christmas and New Year’s Day coming up in the next 4 months. We could increase the level-up rewards given out there. In addition, we could organize weekly/monthly events and competitions where players can obtain rewards such as levels. Examples are knock-out battle competitions, the UPC, updater-of-the-month, etc. – whatever you can think of.
10) Increase the updater reward ladder to give out extra levels (not Rare Candies) to incentivize more players to update, and create new zones to accommodate them if needed. Essentially, this is a “If you want more levels, you have to give something to FB first” option.
__________________

ASB Profile
Fizzy Bubbles Profile|Wishlist Post
Wild Future

Fizzy Bubbles Team:
Spoiler: show
Adventure:
Base:
Transport:
Communication:
Dragons:
Draconid Monsters:
Ex-Admiral Insane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2017, 07:33 AM   #31
TheKnightsFury
Volcano Badge
 
TheKnightsFury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 2,925
So I have seen people giving out more levels in zones and have been doing so myself, I think it is slowly becoming more common but things are also slowing down a little.

I would prefer option 3 or 4 over option 2, simply because option 2 creates more work than what is necessary.

I think we do need a little more incentive for people to update, the ladder is nice but some people obviously need a bit more of a push. There are plenty of people with good writing skills that would make great updators but aren't updating currently. We need updators to keep things working and moving at an enjoyable pace, no one enjoys having to waiting 2-3 weeks for an update because their updator is overloaded. Like even if we could encourage people to take on 2 or 3 people to update it would take a lot of stress of the backs of others and help stop burn out, which can be a big issue. As for how you can give more incentive, I think the reward ladder is fairly good at the moment. Maybe if we introduced something like, an updator who updates X amount of times in a week is able to claim double daycare levels the following week? Could get a little messy but it's a way to increase level up and get more people updating in the process.
__________________
TheKnightsFury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2017, 08:57 AM   #32
Median Dia
Phantump Thief of Luck(?)
 
Median Dia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: The West Side (of the world)
Posts: 1,150
-In-Zone Level Increases: As TKF's already stated, this has become pretty much mandatory because it's been brought up so many times before. A bit late on the uptake here.

-Rare Candies as Zone Rewards/ Purchasable in the Mart: Simply put, one or the other, please. I'd personally prefer that we use the latter option since A) it's less messy and B) it doesn't turn every reply into a moment of indecisive nothingness when the time being wasted could've gone elsewhere. It also prevents people from being a little overzealous with their Candy collecting and draining themselves dry when they could've used some of that money on the Move Tutor- most pokemon stop learning moves by level up waaaaay before Lv. 100, after all!

-Purchasable Levels in the Daycare Centre: This, I feel, is very easily broken. The Daycare already has a default of to levels per week, both of which could got to the same pokemon. If that pokemon has max Bond, that gets doubled into four levels- a pretty hefty number, for sure, but still within the typical range for what's given out in Zones. But then the player adds a Super Pass, probably from a holiday event or something, to the list- already, you're looking at a *eight level increase*! And that's simply using mechanics that are already in place. If the player were to then turn around and purchase more levels while they're at it, they're adding four levels to the astronomical mix per purchase, reaching numbers previously only achieved by stuffing entire Candy hoards down a pokemon's throat! Sure, you could say that the purchased levels can't be altered in any way, but then you're going to be seen as cheapening the value of both the Bond bonus and the Super Pass, and that's just going to cause problems later on down the road. Not quite worth the hassle, I feel.

-Trainer Battles/ Contests/ Battle Frontier: I've got nothing to say with these that hasn't been said already. Next!

-Reward Tier: While this isn't exactly a bad idea, there is something we need to keep an eye out for: Toyo's Hub gets brought up a lot in discussion regarding Auras, since there's a significant push towards having those be rewards for significant achievements as things are. We should probably hold off on that.

-Holiday Levels: First things first, I'd say no to Thanksgiving. Unlike the other holidays we celebrate, that one isn't universal across most of the globe, and many of the countries that do have a Thanksgiving have it drastically different dates- there's going to be problems if we try that one. Second, the events we have are probably already fine in terms of leveling. Between the special Candy varieties, the use in-thread level items, and the Super Passes, we've often seen an explosion in level gains between the months of October and April- and recent developments elsewhere are bound to make those level gains even larger. We really don't need to change these in that regard.

Before I move onto Point 10 (which is a whole 'nother can of worms), I'm going to make a possibly controversial statement. While it's certainly true that we needed to make gaining levels easier compared to TessB, I feel like we're quickly heading down the slippery slope of making them too easy. If we keep pushing like this, eventually something's going to give- and gaining levels is going to mean a lot less. Just something to keep in mind.

Levels as Motivation to Update: Hoo, boy, are you guys looking at this the wrong way! The Staff Rewards program already contains some of, if not the, best rewards in the game right now. It is the only way to get Enigma Eggs (for now) and the Sprays (outside of trading), for a start- those two things alone are pretty big deals! How about the packs of Mysterious Gummis? Those tiers alone are worth a whopping 9 or 15 Bond! Add in the sheer number of Rare Candies and the significant amount of cash gains, and you've got yourself a very nice deal. Heck, this is currently one of the only two ways to get a TM of one's own choosing and one of the tier rewards is a blatantly better version of the ultimate prize in the gacha shop, which doesn't even have a full percent chance of occurring in the most expensive capsule! Many of these things are drastically more valuable than a few measly levels- if they aren't motivating people already, adding the mediocre extra to the system most certainly won't.

Those of us who aren't updating all have our reasons. I, for one, refuse to do anything that makes it so that someone else is relying on me to progress there own story until I'm free from my father's tyrannical hold after being gracelessly yanked away from the internet without enough advanced warning to post in the TA while I was doing PASBL so many goddang times. A good few of the others lack the self-confidence to even try, and we all know MM isn't likely to start up any time soon. So, if you want to add more levels to the Staff Rewards system, go ahead- I'm sure the folks who are already using it would be quite happy about it. Just don't expect to get very many new recruits as a consequence of doing so.
__________________


Tangled Feet- "Only I have the right to hit me!"
Median Dia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2017, 09:10 AM   #33
deoxys
こばやし だいすき~
 
deoxys's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: 私の尾を食べてください OwO
Posts: 6,482
Would really like to start talking about opening up the Battle Frontier at some point soon - I think the proposal was to do 2-3 zones at the beginning, letting players only pick one for the time being as a "test" run and introduce the rest later assuming all goes well. And of course, they'd all be FFA and heavy RPing would not be encouraged, so it shouldn't bea super heavy load on people to handle.
deoxys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2017, 02:57 AM   #34
TheKnightsFury
Volcano Badge
 
TheKnightsFury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 2,925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Admiral Insane View Post
5) Trainer Battles are introduced. I definitely think trainer battles should be incorporated in FB in some manner as I do consider it to be a core mechanic of Pokémon. However, I want it to be an extra option we have available that’s simple – not an over-indulgent mechanic that dominates FB and turns it into a new ASB. Having this become a reliable way to earn levels might do exactly that.
6) Contests. Same as Trainer Battles almost.
7) Battle Frontier/Level-up Zone. Similar to battling but different that allows for more RPing. One problem mentioned is that updater resources (quite substantially) are diverted to this.
Alright so I have pulled these three points from what Ex brought up because I believe these three are kind of met by what I am proposing.

First of all, I would ask you to forget what Trainer battles used to be. I have looked through them, they were terrible, competitive and led to arguments. They also required a referee which took updater focus away from the more important side of FB which is Zone Updates. I think we can all agree that we don't want to create a mini ASB which is what happened in the past, instead we want a way to RP with a bit of freedom and gain some levels at the same time, correct?

What I am proposing is simply that two people get together, RP a battle using their Pokemon and controlling the outcome of the match. Essentially the pair will write a short battle story. Then once a week (like a shop) all completed battles will be finalised and a set amount of levels will be awarded, based on things like creativity, RP quality and overall appeal. Both trainers would receive the same amount of levels, making it non competitive, instead it would encourage people to work and plan together in order to develop a great battle.

Positive points

-Levels: A way to level outside of zones over than candies and daycare but ones that must be earned

-Evolution: It would provide a nice opportunity to evolve Pokemon you don't plan on evolving in zones, providing them with a more memorable evolution than just evolving them in the TO or something.

-Creativity: You could go about the battles however you want, the setting would be yours to choose, the style (double battle, contest battle, hell even a PokeRinger contest, whatever) would be yours to choose.

-Workload: It would only require one person to go through and judge completed battles. People aren't forced to participate in it.

Layout

To start with I would suggest we allow trainers to only participate in one battle at a time. This stops people exploiting the system and farming levels but if in the future we decided we wanted to allow for more than that would be fine.

1. One of the trainers would create a thread in the trainer battles thread, clearly identifying the participants and the Pokemon being used.(for tracking purposes). In the first post they will describe the setting for the battle, send out their Pokemon and order (they should already know the opponent's Pokemon). They would then post in a shop thread (so all battles can be kept track of and updated), identifying the trainers involved, the Pokemon being used and a link to the thread.

2. The other trainer would then reply, sending out their Pokemon and ordering.

3. The first trainer would then reply, giving their orders and RPing the battle. At the end of the reply they would then order again.

4. The second trainer would then reply, giving their orders and RPing the battle. At the end of the reply they would then order again.

5. This happens until the match is concluded. Battles wouldn't always have to end in a KO, it could be a mutual agreement to stop the match (like they do often in the anime). Once the match is done, one of the trainers posts in the shop thread, confirming the end of the battle and providing a link to the last post.

6. At the end of the week, the battle judge would then read through the entire RP and award between 1-6 levels to both trainers based on a marking system.


Obviously one would think trainers will just make the battle go in their favour but I don't think that will happen in most cases. It makes more sense for the battlers to have a mutually agreed upon conclusion for the battle, since they risk lowering the amount of levels they both receive if it is done poorly. Medmana and MM have been having a battle in a base which is quite similar to what I intend http://forums.upnetwork.net/showpost...&postcount=133 .

I mentioned a marking system which is my teacher side coming out. Essentially it would be like a marking rubric

5-6 levels- (what you would be expected to produce)

3-4 levels- (what you would be expected to produce)

1-2 levels- (what you would be expected to produce)

Honestly I would expect most of the time things would fall into the 3-4 range but the 5-6 range would be quite possible. 1-2 I wouldn't expect many to hit but it is there in case it is required.

Battle Length


I would expect the battles to go for at least 5-6 rounds (that is around 5-6 sets of orders so a total of 10-12 replies), this is a similar standard to In Zone battles.

I think that is all I have for now but it is quite likely I have forgotten something, feel free to tear me to shreds but I would prefer we discuss this like the civilised people we are.
__________________

Last edited by TheKnightsFury; 09-12-2017 at 03:13 AM.
TheKnightsFury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2017, 04:48 AM   #35
Gemini Spark
Weavile Pillow
 
Gemini Spark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Resting with Leila <3
Posts: 1,315
Send a message via Skype™ to Gemini Spark
I've been pretty silent amidst all the PvP proposals people have been bouncing around, mostly because I couldn't figure out what to say about it all, but I feel like I should be the one to point out what may be the biggest argument against TKF's idea: none of the battles would feel 100% authentic. There would always be some element that feels scripted and wouldn't be very interesting for other people to read. In fact, the whole notion of a "mutually agreed upon conclusion" in order to have the battle be judged properly says to me that some sort of scripting is required, and I don't see that as quality RP at all. This is why many people are so critical of the Pokemon anime, it's because 1) the outcome, as well as much of the middle of any given battle is so predictable for the most part, and 2) most of the errors are done by the Pokemon, not the trainers, unless the trainer is inexperienced, an overconfident rival, or a villain, all of which have predictable personalities. Where's the mistakes made by the real characters, or the players, in FB's case? I can remember certain battles I did back in old FB, and they were so memorable because either I or my opponent made legitimate, strategic mistakes that cost us the battle. The levels gained from winning certain battles really did feel earned which was the whole appeal to PvP in the first place.

I think people are so hesitant to return to that style because it got so tainted from one person (and the corruption in FB in general) that they'd much rather have everything be sunshine and roses and everyone get exactly the same thing out of PvP. Meanwhile, I don't see much harm in having something where rewards aren't guaranteed for everyone; in fact, if something like that doesn't exist at all in FB, I think we'd be missing out on a crucial element of an RPG: a world where defeats can truly have meaningful implications to your character.
__________________


Avatar made by din-of-hyrule
Battlecut made by the crazy Daisy! *happy snek sounds*
Tumblr | Hyrem's Ask Blog | Wild Future
Gemini Spark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2017, 07:18 AM   #36
Maskerade
Boulder Badge
 
Maskerade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 210
I echo GS's sentiment; having been a part of the old battle system, I had a lot of fun reffing and I think people had fun battling too - with actual wins and losses and their associated implications. This was one system I never really thought was broken enough to be abandoned; fixes came as they were needed, but it was an actual functioning PvP from my point of view.
__________________
Maskerade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2017, 09:32 AM   #37
lilbluecorsola
Snek fam
 
lilbluecorsola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Searching for time
Posts: 4,516
Lil' Bluey

I have to side with GS in this case; this sounds a lot like "chatfight" Battles I used to participate in which were prone to "godmoding", and is basically what's already taking place in Secret Bases from what I hear. Personally I prefer having an unbiased ref to judge, and elements of surprise. One of the best Battles I had was with darkrai where even though it turned into an energy stalemate between his Bronzong and my Azumarill, Stacey made it interesting by having our Pokémon become comically stuck together. You can complain about the energy-draining mechanics of the previous PvP system, but boy if it didn't make for the most hilarious experience.
__________________




Time goes on
The clock hands stopped
The same way, repeatedly


Mekakucity Actors Discussion Thread
lilbluecorsola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2017, 10:42 AM   #38
Missingno. Master
Poison-type Trainer
 
Missingno. Master's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Virbank City
Posts: 3,428
Yeah, battles like these are good for free RP, but as far as I'm concerned, the old battle system, for the most part, fell under the heading of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". One battle, my Meowth managed to beat Raves's Lunatone with exactly 1% of his health remaining, when I wasn't sure I'd win at all. In fact, some of my favorite battles are the ones that are too close to call until the very end.
__________________


My Shiny Pokémon (not up for trade, I don't do requests for Shiny banners or recolored Pokken artwork). FB team banners like the one above, however, those I do requests for.
Missingno. Master is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   UPNetwork > Independent Forums > Fizzy Bubbles > FB Development


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:20 AM.


Design By: Miner Skinz.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.