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Old 05-25-2017, 07:14 AM   #26
Brave Saix
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Newbie chiming in here, so I haven't much Idea as to what all has be offered before. Going off of Sneaze's proposal I'd bump the coins-to-vouchers rate up from being based on the triangle numbers (1,3,6,...) up to being based on the squares. So one would get
  • 1 voucher : 100 coin
  • 2 vouchers : 400 coins
  • 3 vouchers: 900 coins
  • ...
  • 10 vouchers : 10K coins
  • ...
  • 20 vouchers : 40K coins
  • 20 could be a hard cap, and remainders could be converted to Dollars in some manner.

Further I'd add two things:

1. Divide the available items in to groups (i.e. Held, Common TM's, Evolution.) AND require an equal distribution of exchanges in all item groups. These are regular rewards

2. Add threshold rewards at 5, 10, 15 and 20 vouchers as extra rewards. Restrict high power TM's and Pokémon (Limit of 1 total) to this. These are bonus rewards

I'd say
  • 5 vouchers : Rare-tier Pokémon or regular item
  • 10 vouchers : 1 rare TM
  • 15 vouchers : 1 rare TM's or 1 Super-rare Pokemon
  • 20 vouchers : 2 rare TM's or 1 Ultra-rare Pokemon

Example 1: Steve has 1600 coins. This would give them 4 vouchers to use. They choose to get 2 TM's, 1 held item, and 1 evolution item.

Example 2: Allie has 22,300 coins. This is between (15^2)*100 and (16^2*100) so she gets 15 vouchers. This qualifies her for the 5, 10, and 15 voucher threshold rewards. For the 15 vouchers she gets 5 items from each regular item group. For the 5-voucher bonus, she takes the bonus regular item wanting to save the one Pokémon limit for later. For the 10-voucher bonus, TM Thunderbolt. And for the 15-voucher bonus she chooses the super rare pokemon, (Examplemon @ lvl:5). So her total rewards are
  • 6 common TM's (1 bonus)
  • 5 Held Items
  • 5 Evolution Items
  • 1 Rare TM (threshold reward)
  • 1 Super-rare Pokemon
  • 500 remaining coins converted to dollars

This should hopfully prevent TM stockpiling (at least the higher powered ones) and make the Pokémon appropriately available.

Edit: Jerichi's post: Make it a small RP event thread with a small item reward. Something along the lines of a Going-out-of-Business/Customer-appreciation deal. Nothing more that one or two RP posts per person.

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Old 05-25-2017, 07:31 AM   #27
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Coming from someone who has coins but never wanted to risk them in the old gacha system of doom who'S had some time to think on this now, I think at this rate, just go for option 1. If I really want an old CfP mon (hint hint it's Eevee), that's what I have my Memakyu for, and I can presumably find it in an adventure at some point, so Option 3 is just gross instant gratification, let's not get in on that mess.

The community is in favor of phasing them out, let's be real: practically any time an item is brought up for being made coins only purchasable, it gets argued as to why it shouldn't be seen as a luxury item if it's name isn't Shiny Spray. The problem is, as others have said before me, that we seem to believe we owe people stuff for their longtime use of a broken system. Coins are unhealthy by merit of their system having been unhealthy as fuck, so best not make any fantasies that we "owe" anyone anything because in the end it will just make people want to choose a reset process that lets them get stuff out of it from that sentiment, which is really counterproductive to the idea of a wipe/reset.
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Old 05-25-2017, 07:41 AM   #28
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Option 1, as much as everyone hates the idea of it, is actually the healthiest for the RP. This is a growing pain. Simply put, the Casino in its entirety was going to make any system we ever put in non-functional. You have to accept that. If we were to revamp the coin system to make it more fair, the Casino would ultimately ruin that. People made too many coins in too short of a time. The Casino in the past was super abused by members who realized it was capless, and we've all had to pay the price because the mods didn't want to get rid of their shiny mountains. Despite it being the right thing to do.

The longer we let this topic stew, the more toxic, the more bitter, the more self-serving people are going to become. Already this has been started by one member's passive-aggressive behavior about their coins. We need to cut ties with this. It's that simple. It's going to hurt. I'm going to be honest here: the context with this is different than a global reset. If we wipe coins completely, you all can go on with your RP without being disadvantaged. You weren't using the coins anyways. It's not diminishing what people have done in this RP under Tess' yoke; its shedding the very clear light on how you gained coins.

You played a weekly minigame with a luck-based payout. We're moving to a game in which we want people to actually play the game. We want people to RP, to go in zones, and we're trying to find ways to encourage that. In my opinion, letting people go ham wild with coins when it violates the spirit and the desire of what we want from our RP is wrong.

So simply, rather than letting people buy Pokemon and shit, what I suggest is simple: we nuke coins. They're gone. Forever. Bye. What I am willing to do, though, if instead of giving everyone reimbursement, we're going to give you something for helping rebuild FB. That's significantly more important in coins, and you all have worked hard and put a lot of passion into this. It's the reason our game is running. It likely will not be a Pokemon, but we will make sure that its a nice gift people will enjoy.
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Old 05-25-2017, 07:44 AM   #29
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With Emi here. There's really no way to settle this that keeps the RP as it should be without flat removing coins. It's not like they were hard-earned anyway.
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Old 05-25-2017, 08:14 AM   #30
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Yeah, I'm also with Emi. Coins feel like a diseased limb that need to be amputated. Let's cut them off and try to heal, yeah? It'll hurt, but we'll be better for it.

(Also, sorry for getting my feefees hurt earlier; it was uncalled for.)
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Old 05-25-2017, 08:29 AM   #31
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As I suggest and Emi relayed, perhaps we just have a little giveaway of non-mon prizes to everyone to show our appreciation for putting FB back together again?
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Old 05-25-2017, 08:44 AM   #32
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Hooray for removing coins and receiving a complimentary gift bag!
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Old 05-25-2017, 09:09 AM   #33
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I want to go on record to state that I am also okay with exchanging coins for items/gift bags/whatever the fuck. Just not Pokemon (unless it's an adoption center voucher).
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Old 05-25-2017, 09:33 AM   #34
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yeah im ok with a gift bag
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Old 05-25-2017, 10:11 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by deoxys View Post
I want to go on record to state that I am also okay with exchanging coins for items/gift bags/whatever the fuck. Just not Pokemon (unless it's an adoption center voucher).
This.

But I think Emi's/Jeri's idea is pretty solid. Though I might suggest only a gift bag for people who have some balance of coins? Makes it easier for them to not feel cheated out of their coin balances, and let's be real most people who don't have coin balances are like me or TKF who just joined and I'd argue as a rule people like us are waaaaaaay too new to have contributed meaningfully to the development process aside from throwing two cents in here and there.
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Old 05-25-2017, 11:03 AM   #36
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Gift bag works for me.
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Old 05-25-2017, 02:47 PM   #37
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So I had more time to think, and I've come to the conclusion that there is simply no good way to work out a clearance sale without a large majority of the group feeling cheated in some way. Unfortunately, the least bad option left is to just nuke all the coins, though I do like the idea of some sort of cool gift bag for everyone if only to get something out of this mess.
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Old 05-25-2017, 03:51 PM   #38
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I'll reiterate my statement on the whole gift bag thing:

I don't understand why anyone who was originally against Option 3 (the item version) would go for this either, considering the fact that it is essentially a re-branding of Option 3, in practice. At base I don't have terribly much against giving a gift bag to people that helped reshape FB over the last few months, but to me if that were truly the spirit of said gift bag, it should have never been linked to the coin discussion in the first place. The way you're selling it, it is the same universal compensation people had argued against beforehand.

I'm not further arguing for or against it here, but I do want to point out that the Emi!post and Option 3 are functionally the same, just with different wording.
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Old 05-26-2017, 02:43 AM   #39
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Personally I'm with Emi at this point and say just nuke 'em. If it's causing this much controversy/complications then I think the best course is to wipe it all with a clean slate and be done with it. I know I'm not one to talk since I have barely any Coins left on my account and am thus not affected one way or the other, but if it were Candies then I'd be more than happy to relinquish my stash if it means putting an end to this discourse. I want to see FB coming together to embrace RP and having fun as our number one goals, and keep moving forward with positive change rather than getting hung up on holding onto a "broken" currency.

That said, I am curious how TMs will become available in the future, if at all. Whether they will still be easily purchaseable, or can only be gained through Adventuring or special events. The answer may or may not influence my stance.

Although for that matter, this is a bit of a tangent (plus possibly contrary) but- I do currently have some concerns about the direction of making everything "RP-obtainable only", especially when it comes to Pokémon. GS brought up a good point about the possibility of encountering a Pokémon a player wants in a Zone, but with a different personality than envisioned. Yes, you could work something out privately with the Updator, but I feel that's a bit too meddling. Zone Adventures to me are an organic experience that I like to be surprised by. I actually haven't used the Wishlist thread because I'm not a big fan of Updators knowing all my exact wants and catering specifically to them; in some cases I'd rather have pure spontaneity and from there let stories and relationships develop naturally. I kept my love of Alolan Sandshrew mostly under wraps for the course of the event because I wanted to see what would happen by going in with a somewhat blind agenda, and although I didn't run into what I truly desired off the bat I was able to work around with both my Updator and GS to come to a satisfying conclusion for both parties.

In that sense, I think there's a balance to be had between mutual understanding and helping each other towards a common goal - whether it be between Updator and Updatee or amongst community players - but also going with the flow and not relying too much on others to give you exactly what you want. I believe there should be an option for players to readily gain access to new Pokes without necessarily depending on others' RP input, if for example they have a particular character/backstory in mind. There's the AC, but unless the previous owner went with the option of "releasing but a completely random unrelated 'mon of the exact same kind suddenly shows up", the 'mon will still have a sense of prior ownership attached, regardless of whether they actually received any development before. It's partly for that reason I've been hesitant to adopt a certain 'mon from there, because I have a distinct persona in mind but feel a bit odd displacing it over a "used" creature, so to speak.

I'm not arguing against making RP/sharing FB's ultimate priority over "FREE 'MONS EVERY MONDAY" ŕ la the Egg House, but like GS said - I feel like a mix of both would preferably be ideal.
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Old 06-06-2017, 06:12 PM   #40
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This has been bubbling on the back-burner for a bit, and we would like to get a final round of discussion before a decision is reached. We realize that this has been a very heated topic in the past, so we would like to get this settled as quickly and painlessly as possible, one way or another.

To begin, we have been working with Sneaze on his voucher idea. Here is what we came up with:

COIN-VOUCHER EXCHANGE

Anything above 0 but less than 1,000 = 10 vouchers
1,000 - 4,999 = 20 vouchers
5,000 - 12,499 = 30 vouchers
12,500 - 29,999 = 40 vouchers
30,000 - 124,999 = 50 vouchers
125,000 - 149,999 = 60 vouchers
150,000 - 199,999 = 70 vouchers
200,000 - 399,999 = 80 vouchers
400,000 - 599,999 = 90 vouchers
600,000 and above = 100 vouchers

VOUCHER REWARDS

1 voucher - Dive Ball, Dusk Ball, Heal Ball, Nest Ball, Net Ball, Quick Ball, Repeat Ball, Timer Ball, Premier Ball, Power Gems
2 vouchers - Fast Ball, Level Ball, Lure Ball, Friend Ball, Moon Ball, Love Ball, Heavy Ball
3 vouchers - Luxury Ball, Cherish Ball
4 vouchers - Incense (Full, Lax, Luck, Odd, Pure, Rock, Rose, Sea, Wave, Macho)
5 vouchers - elemental booster items (charcoal, magnet, poison barb, etc)
10 vouchers - Flute (Black, White, Blue, Red or Yellow)
15 vouchers - Generation VII TM of choice
20 vouchers - evolutionary stones (sun, moon, leaf, fire, water, thunder)
25 vouchers - Metal Coat, King's Rock, Oval Stone, Deepseascale, Deepseatooth, Upgrade, Dawn Stone, Dusk Stone, Shiny Stone, Razor Claw, Razor Fang, Dragon Scale, Dubious Disc, Prism Scale
30 vouchers - Electrizer, Magmarizer, Protector, Reaper Cloth, Frost (Fridge) Card, Wash (Washer) Card, Cut (Lawnmower) Card, Spin (Fan) Card, Heat (Oven) Card
40 vouchers - Mienfoo, Gastly, Baby Pokemon of Choice,
50 vouchers - Eevee, Feebas, Absol
60 vouchers - Rotom, Lapras, Beldum, Castform, Dratini, Ditto
70 vouchers - fossil Pokemon of choice, Porygon

Feel free to agree, disagree or propose adjustments - HOWEVER, please remember that we are trying to reach a decision that's best for the community as a whole, and it is our sincere hope in this final leg of discussion that our members consider not only what's best for them, but what's best for the community. The other people in this community are ones you have contact with on a regular basis; as an updater, an SO, a friend or a fellow roleplayers. Please respect the opinions of others - try to see things from their point of view, and acknowledge their points before presenting your own perspective.
If this cannot be done, then the ultimate answer will be what is possibly the fairest one but the least profitable - everyone gets nothing.

With this in mind, we understand that this is not an easy topic, and the answers are not necessarily simple. That said, once it's done - it's done, and we can move forward to bigger, better things.
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Old 06-06-2017, 06:23 PM   #41
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I'm liking the look of this voucher system, personally. Those who have coins but not many of them still get some good options, while those with insanely high balances are still rather limited in terms of how much they can buy. I'd be all for this system as-is, myself.
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Old 06-06-2017, 07:29 PM   #42
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I second MM's post.

The only thing that annoys me slightly is wondering how those who have 0 coins feels about it... I mean, I wouldn't mind if someone who has 0 coins gets 5 vouchers or something like that, so that they don't feel left out.
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Old 06-06-2017, 09:44 PM   #43
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My only question right now is if people will be getting reimbursements, if only partial, for investments made on luxury items that no longer have monetary value, such as secret bases or trading cards. For the record I'm perfectly fine if this isn't the case. I only mention it because the question has been brought up numerous times without a concrete answer, and I can't speak for others in this regards.
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Old 06-06-2017, 09:58 PM   #44
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Local area "that guy" reporting in: Why do we need to have Pokemon as a reward?
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:20 PM   #45
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Local area "that guy" reporting in: Why do we need to have Pokemon as a reward?
I absolutely can't get on board with Pokemon as being rewards for this. Going to agree with Deo. At base, I feel like Pokemon should be roleplayed for, period.
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:29 PM   #46
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Not gonna lie, my plans for this if this voucher system goes into place is to buy a Pokémon, but also to RP my character encountering said Pokémon and having it join his team. With that in mind, perhaps we could add a stipulation that anyone wishing to purchase Pokémon with Coin Vouchers must RP their character obtaining the Pokémon? We're already considering a thread where you're allowed to occasionally RP a story to obtain something on your wishlist (at least, as far as I know we're still considering this), this would be the same basic principle. It sounds like a fair solution from where I stand- those who want one last shot at a CfP Pokémon can get just that, and those who want all Pokémon to be RP'd for also get just that.
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:43 PM   #47
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My attempt at a compromise: People get their free pokemon via vouchers, but you have to turn the vouchers in an event zone like the springtime event in order to actually claim the pokemon.

That way people get their prizes, but that have to actually adventure and roleplay for them.
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:45 PM   #48
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That's an entirely fair compromise on that point.
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Old 06-06-2017, 11:13 PM   #49
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Riding off of Gary's suggestion.

Marion proposed a 'Casino Finale' event, details still scarce. Everyone could get in and participate. It is not exclusive to anyone.

BUT, if you cash in your vouchers at the beginning of your journey in the event, based on EAI's idea for Pokemon rewards (which he has split up into four different voucher 'tiers' - 40, 50, 60, and 70 vouchers), when you partake in the 'Casino' event, you will encounter one of the Pokemon in the tier you chose, and will be given the opportunity to catch it/take it. Any other individual who participates in the event... might be able to "rescue" Pokemon, or what have you, but they probably won't be the same level of rarity as EAI's proposals, leaving these 'exclusive' mon for those who have a ton of vouchers.

That obviously means you won't be able to just outright say "I want a Rotom" or "I want a Lapras". This keeps everyone on more or less level ground and stands by the true core of RPing - you are getting Pokemon, good Pokemon, but the compromise is you aren't guaranteed to get the one you want. And that is part of what it is to be in a story with unknown variables that can come out of left field. Anything can happen.

To keep things fair, though, because I understand some people might not like that proposal... since you would be gunning for one of those particular Pokemon in that tier, presumably, you would be given three chances, like with the Springtime Egg Hunt, to accept the Pokemon your updator presents to you. If you get one you didn't want, you can always trade it.

I imagine this idea won't be popular but, you know. If we aren't going to just scrap coins outright, I'm trying to compromise what I think is the most healthy result out of all of this by trying to give everyone some amount of satisfaction in the deal and not leaving any one particular party feeling 100% screwed. Because honestly, deep down, I sort of just want to go back to what Emi said and nuke them entirely. But I know that will leave a lot of people feeling broken. So, this is my proposal.
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Old 06-07-2017, 12:01 AM   #50
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Okay, I wasn't sure about Sneaze's idea because it seemed pretty complicated and not really worth using for a one-time deal, but since the effort has already been put in towards making it happen I'm not nearly as against it as I was before.

One really important question, however: would we be able to cash in items like Rare Bones or Haunter Plushies toward our total amount of coins before converting into vouchers? I ask because I have a quite a few of those items in my inventory, and even cashing in one of them, each one worth 5,000 coins, would be just enough to put my total into the next tier of coins. (The rest wouldn't be enough for a second tier btw.) If not, I'd be okay with that, though I'd still want to know what the plan is for them if they aren't for adding to existing coin totals.
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