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Old 08-08-2016, 05:33 PM   #1
Talon87
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It's Princess Diancie time!


So here's the deal: I've wanted a good OU team for a long time. But I suck at team building! ^^; That's why I'd like your help in creating a good team centered around one of my favorite Pokémon, Diancie.

Spoiler: show


Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: ??? Atk / ??? SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- ???
- ???

This is the part that's non-negotiable. Diancie's going to be our mega, she's going to be running her mixed set of physical Rock (Diamond Storm) and special Fairy (Moonblast), and she's going to have the EVs to support such a set.

The rest is up to us. Will she have 8 Atk / 248 SpAtk like the Smogon set calls for? Will she have HP:Fire or Earth Power? Will she have Protect? Will she have some other radical move? We'll see! That's going to depend on the needs of the team and the wants of the Talon.

Everything else, I'm pretty much willing to try out. Go hog wild with legendaries. Go nuts with UU additions. Whatever works. Whatever is going to make for a solid team that I can take past 1800 on the OU ladder.

If any of the following helps you to formulate ideas more easily, because building a team around only one Pokémon is hard stuff ...



Pick any number of these Pokémon to include on the team to start building off of. Could be zero, could be all four if they have actual synergy O_o which I seriously doubt but who knows!
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Old 08-08-2016, 05:40 PM   #2
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idk too much about synergy or OU, but if you're running MDiancie you will almost definitely want to have a counter to Mega Scizor in there.
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Old 08-08-2016, 05:45 PM   #3
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Diancie is a fantastic mega who holds a serious mixed threat. With Moonblast and Diamond Storm she has very few hard counters, and even less when she runs Earth Power. I personally suggest running 88/168/252 for offenses with Naive being your best nature. Also totally slap on protect. You need protect to garuntee mega.

Good options with her include Heatran who basically checks almost all of her counters. RH Tangroeth is a fantastic physical wall atm due to hard walling most of the major physical threats and has regenerstor recovery. Both Keldeo and Tornadus-T are great offensive options, with Torny-T acting as a great pivot. Landorus-T is great too as he can set up hazards and pivot. Washtom is a great defensive pivot and WoW is always a fantastic choice. Also the Lati twins. Latios is the best offensive defogger in the tier while Latias is a great support choice. I also heavily suggest running Scarf Excadrill or another haed hitting physical attacker.
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Old 08-08-2016, 05:55 PM   #4
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What does 88 / 168 hit? Usually when you go mixed one of the important things is that your investment counts. 4 at least OHKOs Mega CharX.

Mega Metagross, Heatran, and Specially Defensive Excadrill are by far and away the biggest threats Diancie can face in an OU match. It's a good idea to use something that can consistently come in on them and KO them with ease.

Volcanion is amazing for this job and for its ability to check other threats as well, thanks to its typing and Water Absorb. Steam Eruption will do massive damage to any of them on the switch-in and Flamethrower / Fire Blast will roast them.

Special Walls are also an issue, along with Choice Scarf Pokemon. You'll probably want some hazard supports as Megas typically do. Garchomp or Jirachi fill this role well. Talonflame can use Clefable as set-up bait and likes that Diancie bounces hazards. You could use Staraptor but it lacks a resistance to Moonblast.

Past that, I'm out of ideas.
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Old 08-08-2016, 05:56 PM   #5
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For Diancie, normally you take Earth Power and then Protect, but some people bluff Protect and instead take Rock Polish. And because you're using Mega Diancie, as many steel switch ins as you can is important, so take Milotic for sure. The rest might be useful but don't form a nice core so put them on hold
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Old 08-08-2016, 06:07 PM   #6
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(Post written before Emi replied, after Lil'twick replied.)

I was throwing a team together as you guys got in the first replies. I made a substitution (swapped out Togekiss for Heatran) because you're absolutely right about how good Heatran would be at answering the majority of Diancie's counters. I want to see how Magnezone works (I have precious little experience using one), so I tossed him on here. And Terrakion flew on just 'cause I wanted a physical answer to Clefable (Iron Head) and Blissey (Close Combat) that wasn't Jirachi for a change. Like I said, everything's up for debate except for Diancie herself. Here's the current set:

Spoiler: show

Princess Diancie (Diancie) @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Diamond Storm
- Moonblast
- Earth Power
- Calm Mind


Azusa (Milotic) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Marvel Scale
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Haze


Bulldog (Heatran) @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Flash Cannon
- Stealth Rock


Tatsumaki (Staraptor) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Close Combat
- Double-Edge
- U-turn


A-135 (Magnezone) @ Air Balloon
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Magnet Rise
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]


Porthos (Terrakion) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Iron Head

Zero idea about their cohesion as I haven't taken them out for a test spin yet. Immediate thoughts, incorporating information from Emi's and roto's replies as well:
  • While I really like the idea of Latios and other Defoggers in general (because I play a mean switching game), I like even better the idea of punishing the opponent's switches with Heatran's Stealth Rock. Diancie doesn't need people switching around constantly. She wants people staying put so they can die.
  • I don't think Terrakion fits, but right now the team has only two physical attackers (Diancie doesn't really count if I run the Smogon set, which advises minimum Attack EVs)
  • I want to give a Protect-less set a try, at least for now. You guys are stressing the importance of Protect for the mega turn, but wouldn't I be better off switching Defense Mode Diancie in against something that gets hosed by Mega Diancie, letting it run away for a counter, and mega evolving as it runs away? For that reason I've considered a CM set that reallocates EVs to Attack (for maximum Diamond Storm power) because we can always get Moonblast power back up via one easy Calm Mind. But if Protect is really that important, like it is with Beedrill, then sure, I'll have to wave the white flag and go with Smogon's set unadulterated.
  • It might be redundant having both Heatran and Magnezone to answer Steel threats. I dunno. We will see. I have so little experience with Magnezone that he'll probably be the one that goes, but I feel kind of bad for him since I know plenty of people use him well at higher levels of play. I'd like to try him out too. Can't do it all at once though.
I dunno. I will probably take this v.0.0.1 team out for a test spin and see how it does. Obviously the 1000s don't really count, but we can at least gauge team cohesion to some degree.
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Old 08-08-2016, 06:10 PM   #7
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Consider this thread a sandbox. Feel free to copy-paste text from above and make changes. (Make the changes obvious with bold or colored font too. Makes it really easy for me to see what has been changed.) Feel free to copy-paste other non-Talon people's information too. Consider it a sandbox. Consider it a clay sculpture and we're all sat at the table within arm's reach of it. Feel free to mold it however. Everyone can discuss what they think works and what doesn't.
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Old 08-08-2016, 06:18 PM   #8
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Just a slight personal thought here, but four of those are weak to Ground, two doubly, and Milotic seems to be the only vaguely reasonable answer you have to it. Is that going to be enough, or should you cut down on the Ground weaknesses a bit more? Yes I know there's Air Balloons but I'm still not massively sold on this team being able to cover Ground.
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Old 08-08-2016, 07:15 PM   #9
Talon87
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Latest iteration of the team, courtesy of Discord suggestions. Changes in bold blue:


Princess Diancie (Diancie) @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 8 Atk / 248 SpAtk / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Diamond Storm
- Moonblast
- Earth Power
- Protect


Euphrates (Slowbro) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Slack Off
- Psyshock
- Fire Blast


Rangeet (Landorus-Therian) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 8 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Stone Edge



Tatsumaki (Staraptor) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Close Combat
- Double-Edge
- U-turn


A-135 (Magnezone) @ Air Balloon
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Magnet Rise
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Fire]


Porthos (Terrakion) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Iron Head

Current concerns/problems:
  • Terrakion not pulling weight (but Roto says he forms a good pair with Diancie, so ...)
  • Magnezone not pulling weight (but Roto says he's not expected to against HO teams, only against more defensive teams that run things like Skarmory and Ferrothorn)
  • Several critical chess pieces, like Staraptor, are really hating entry hazards.
  • Terrakion doesn't have time to even get an attack off, much less use Rock Polish. Reconsider.
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Old 08-08-2016, 07:21 PM   #10
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So one idea is going Band raptor and scarf terrak. That lets terrak get hits quick while staraptor chunks even harder. The other option of course is replacing terrak with something completely different. My first thought for a good terrak replacement is Breloom because grass resist water and ground, two types that diancie doesn't like (thought its not very bulky) while keeping the fighitng coverage. Other options would be probably other offensive grass types for diancie synergy defensively or fire or fighting types to synergize with diancie offensively
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Old 08-08-2016, 09:23 PM   #11
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Latest version of the team:

Spoiler: show

Princess Diancie (Diancie) @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 8 Atk / 248 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Diamond Storm
- Moonblast
- Earth Power
- Protect


Euphrates (Slowbro) (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Psyshock
- Fire Blast


Rangeet (Landorus-Therian) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 8 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Stone Edge


Tatsumaki (Staraptor) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Close Combat
- Double-Edge
- U-turn


Serperior @ Wide Lens
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Glare



Porthos (Terrakion) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Iron Head

Changelog:
- swapped out Magnezone
- swapped in Serperior
- gave Terrakion Choice Scarf

So far, this is much better. Magnezone really wasn't pulling his weight -- a slow Electric is pretty bad in terms of placing offensive pressure on enemy Waters or Flyers, and while Magnet Pull is theoretically awesome for trapping Diancie's worst enemies, it's not really necessary. :o Turns out that Terrakion's Close Combat tends to be more than enough to dispense with most Heatran, while Serperior's ContraryLeafStorm-boosted HP:Fires are doing ample damage to things that are susceptible to Fire. This might change as I get higher up the ladder and Steels like Skarmory and Ferrothorn start to become more common, but for right now, boxing Magnezone was the right choice. If he is a good fit for OU, he's certainly not a very good fit at the bottom rung of the ladder.

Serperior applies interesting pressure. No one wants to lose to Leaf Storm spam, so players table their plans and implement emergency countermeasures. That's how you play the game, ofc, but the consequence for my team is that I often times get to remove some key threats to Diancie and/or Slowbro and/or Terrakion, and all because the player is too preoccupied with throwing answers at my Serperior to realize that he's tossing away his victory conditions in favor of putting out an immediate fire in front of him. Can't say he's wrong, it's just ... Serperior is doing its job of applying pressure. Again, this is something I can't necessarily expect to last once I get higher on the ladder. But for right now, it's working.

One weird thing right now though is ... I feel like the rest of the team is starting to come together (which is good!) ... but I feel like the fifth wheel right now is none other than the princess herself, Diancie. ^^; While the team we're building might be a good team, I'm kind of worried it's not really a good Mega Diancie team. Which is weird and all, seeing as it was birthed by our collective efforts to put things on a team which synergize well with her. I dunno. It's something to look into as I keep going. If at any point though I feel the answer to the question, "Would this team be better if I replaced Mega Diancie with a different mega?" is "Yes," then I feel like we've messed up somewhere. I dunno. Maybe that's not the right way to think about it, I'm not completely sure.
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Old 08-10-2016, 08:49 AM   #12
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Status update: been losing a lot recently. Was 15-3, am now 18-10. The team has a lot of problems against Pokémon and strategies I keep seeing, hence the losses.

Weavile: this little fuck is a huge thorn in my side. The Focus Sash Ice Shard variants shit all over my Choice Scarf Staraptor. The Life Orb variants make life absolute hell for Slowbro. That's actually the bigger problem. I can deal with killing Weavile other ways besides speed war hax (e.g. Choice Scarf), but it's the utter lack of anything at all on the team that is a safe switch in that sucks. Staraptor, Serperior, and Landorus are all weak to Ice, Slowbro is weak to Dark, and Diancie is made of glass. Only Terrakion can eat both Dark hits and Ice ones, and even then he's hilariously 2HKOed by Icicle Crash, meaning that an Icicle Crash + Ice Shard is still putting him in a really tough spot. Not to mention that once I lose Terrakion elsewhere in the fight, Weavile suddenly becomes their win condition. That's what's been happening in a lot of my losses: Terrakion does his job, he KOes one or more enemies, but eventually he falls, that's life, that's supposed to happen, and then Weavile comes in and is like "HEY GAIZ! " and wrecks house.

Putting Heatran back on the team might be a good answer. Flame Body's a nice deterrent to physical attackers. He's 4x resistant to Ice. He's neutral to Dark. Even when the Weavile have Low Kick, Flame Body's still there at least to give them pause.

But who would he replace? Replacing Serperior's kinda out of the question, as the whole reason for adding Serperior to the squad was "I HAVE NO WATER ANSWERS! T_T" and Heatran ain't exactly helping in that department. He could replace Slowbro, but then I'd be without my physical wall. Not to mention that Slowbro's moveset is a lot more diverse and generally helpful than Heatran's.

Really, I think that Weavile is revealing what I've suspected since a couple of nights ago: this team is in need of 2-3 replacements, not just one. It might even come down to, "We keep Diancie and one other team member but the entire rest of the team has to go."

Stall: While it's less common to see the ever-successful stall at the bottom of the ladder, I have seen it occasionally -- and have always lost to it. Where Hyper Offense tends to muscle past Stall, this team can't. And because it can't, and because it lacks any other answers to deal with Stall -- no healing, no entry hazard removal, no anything of the sort -- my loss is guaranteed.

I'm very familiar with Starmie, with how he operates. I've used one competitively from 1999 all the way until early 2014 when I retired him in favor of Greninja. While I still prefer Greninja (and am still waiting for Alola to see the frog unbanned; have a heart, Smogon), Starmie makes up for his lack of punching power with the ever-useful Rapid Spin. One of the reasons he fell off my team in '14 was precisely because no one was setting entry hazards anymore. This appears to have changed in 2016. Entry hazards appear to be back in full force. I've had numerous opponents not only lay three layers of Spikes and Stealth Rocks but even lay at least one layer of other hazards, be it one layer of Toxic Spikes or the single-application Sticky Web. Litwick mentioned Latios and Defog earlier. I have toyed around with a Latios running Defog, Memento, Draco Meteor, and Psyshock on another team. It's quite possible I'll bring him in here. But I might bring Starmie back too. Perhaps he'll replace Serperior. I dunno, 'cause ...

Electrics: Surprisingly, this team is very weak to Electrics. Not weak to electricity. Weak to Electric-type Pokémon. Whether it's Heat Wave or HP:Ice, time after time my team's nominally "best" anti-Electric answers (Landorus, Serperior) are losing to them. Staraptor and Slowbro die to Electric itself. Diancie's made of glass. So again, this leaves us with just Terrakion to pick up the pieces and try to forge a path to victory for me. And he just can't do it. 'Cause he's defensively weak himself. He can't keep taking HP:Ices or Thunderbolts. That's not a suitable answer.

Landorus-T is one of my weaker contributions thus far. I can never lead with him (because Weavile), his Stealth Rocks are almost always instantly Defogged away, and his attacks are surprisingly weak. While he was a cool suggestion in theory, I feel like he might be one of the 2-3 Pokémon I mentioned earlier that is going to get replaced come teambuilding's end. He chokes to Ice too hard, and Ice is everywhere. Rotom-Wash is an especially huge pain in the ass because of Levitate and no Mold Breaker. Huge defense, an immunity to Ground instead of a weakness, and STAB Hydro Pump means he's a solid, solid answer to Landorus. So while I think Landorus may have to go ... who would be his replacement?

Summary of where we stand
  • bring in a Defogger and/or Rapid Spinner
  • possibly abandon my own Stealth Rocks; they're currently more trouble than they're worth
  • chopping block: Landorus-T, Slowbro, Serperior
  • chopping block one level down: Staraptor, even Terrakion
  • staying put: Diancie (IT'S THE DREAM T_T), probably Terrakion tbh because let's make this pairing work if we can
Help. ;-;
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:21 AM   #13
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I'm pretty awful at team building as I've said, hence why I'm here requesting help, but here's what I came up with in response to the above issues:



Slowbro's been replaced with Azumarill, Landorus has been replaced with Heatran, Staraptor's been replaced with Latios, and Serperior's been replaced with Starmie. Azumarill should be a pretty helpful answer to Weavile, as should Heatran (who I gave Flame Body over Flash Fire). I'm going to miss Staraptor, but Azumarill is nominally there to make up for his missing physical might while Latios is now here to offer some much-needed momentum shifts with Defog and Memento. Helping Latios clear the field of entry hazards is Starmie, with his Rapid Spin.

Electrics are still a pretty big problem though. :\ Slowbro for Azumarill doesn't change the balance, nor does Serperior (Heat Wave Zapdos) for Starmie (generic electric attacks). Latios (HP:Ice) is better than Staraptor (general electric attacks), but not by much. And Heatran isn't meant to take electric beatings any more than Terrakion is. So I dunno.

I'll probably take it out for one or two test spins before anyone gets a chance to reply, but I'll still ask you now: thoughts?
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:21 AM   #14
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While it doesn't help your Electric weakness, Keldeo can help both against Weavile and against Stall. It's still rather frail though.

EDIT: Heatran can deal with Electrics if its specially defensive.
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Old 08-10-2016, 09:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emi View Post
While it doesn't help your Electric weakness, Keldeo can help both against Weavile and against Stall. It's still rather frail though.

EDIT: Heatran can deal with Electrics if its specially defensive.
Forgot about Keldeo. Keldeo might be a much better option than Azumarill.

Haven't battled yet, btw, and probably won't get to now for a couple of hours. So keep those suggestions coming, to help me avert crisis and more pointless losses! orz ^^;

EDIT: Got one battle in. http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-414308032 I won it 4-0, but it was pretty perilous. The team is definitely weak against dedicated rain teams. Azumarill came in clutch (because it laughs at both Politoed and Kingdra), but Swift Swim Kabutops isn't fucking around. The Stone Edge miss was invaluable; while setting up Belly Drum was ensured (barring a crit), getting to sweep his entire team afterwards was not. Getting to be at 4x Attack and 75% HP was pretty rad.

EDIT 2: Got a second battle in. Won it 4-0. :o http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-414316114 I get off to a terrible, the-most-nubbish-of-noobish starts. Forgetting Magic Bounce, misprediction, a whole smorgasbord of awfulness. I end up having to sacrifice Starmie just to a) convince my opponent I am a scrub so that b) he doesn't do anything crazy and I can get a hold of the reins to this match once again. Once I do that, I begin to take control back, bit by bit. My team had a really great match-up against his. Heatran was anathema to Skarmory, Amoongus, and Weavile. Azumarill was great against Weavile and Chansey. Azumarill, Terrakion, and Diancie all laughed at Chansey. (Some more than others, as we can see from Terrakion's paralysis.) So yeah. Bit by bit by bit, I dismantled his team and left him with no options.

I have no idea where I would fit it on (or even if I need to right now), but a healing option would be nice. Paralysis on sweepers like Terrakion and Azumarill sure does suck. But no one on the team currently can learn Heal Bell or Aromatherapy afaik, and even if they could I'm not sure if it's worth the slot to teach it.

Last edited by Talon87; 08-10-2016 at 10:03 AM.
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Old 08-10-2016, 11:35 AM   #16
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Mini update. Since implementing the new team, my score's gone from 18-10 to 23-11. The one game I lost, I was forced to concede to my opponent two turns of Calm Mind on a Raikou.* Every other game, I've won. One was 1-0, one was 3-0, two were 4-0, and this latest one would've probably been 4-0.

I won't say the team is "good" in the sense that it's great. It feels like patchwork. As I said on Discord, it feels held together by tape and Elmer's glue. I have little doubt that once I muscle past the 1300s on into the 1400s, the team won't help me rise much farther and I'll have to make some new changes. But in the sense that the team is helping me to deal with the Weavile plague of lower OU, it is most definitely "good." Good enough to ensure that every time my opponent has had a Weavile I have won the match.

For now, I'm going to hold off on replacing Azumarill with Keldeo because I'm pleased with Azumarill's performance. She deals decent damage unboosted, colossal damage boosted (of course), and the threat of the latter is a wonderful deterrent to opponents. I get to play a lot of mind games thanks to the threat of Belly Drum being on the set. Opponents wonder if it's there, and they wonder if I am going to use it or not. Many times when they incorrectly predict that I will use it, I am able to punish them with Play Rough or Knock Off. It's nice.

Heatran's also pretty rad. I'm old school biased against legendary spam and I have a personal beef with Heatran dating back to Gen 4 OU, but I've mostly softened on both these points and I'm enjoying using him so far. Fire/Steel's nice but for the obvious 4x weakness, and the Modest set I'm running packs a surprising punch (as evidenced by the pseudo-OHKO on Gigalith with Flash Cannon).

Starmie's probably the weakest of the three new additions, but he's also the one I'm most familiar with, so I feel like I've been able to use him correctly at a lot of key junctures. Sending him out when doing so would force the flow to be switched in my favor and likewise not sending him out when to do so would be to fall for an enemy trap ...

* I called that he would CM when he actually Subbed and I used Memento. I then had to switch out to someone else, at which time he used CM. I then broke the sub, at which time he CMed a second time. Basically one poor call that quite literally cost me the entire match. He never had to switch Raikou out again.
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Old 08-10-2016, 04:47 PM   #17
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So to kinda get used to Mega Diancie I slapped together an offensive team. The original version had Serperior and Lucario instead of Raikou and Scizor, but it wasn't very good and these two work much much better. I'm currently sitting at 1514 with it.

Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Diamond Storm
- Moonblast
- Protect
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Keldeo-Resolute @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Secret Sword
- Scald
- Icy Wind

Tornadus-Therian @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 76 Atk / 180 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Grass Knot
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- Superpower

Terrakion @ Focus Sash
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Taunt

Scizor @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off
- Superpower

Raikou @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Calm Mind
- Hidden Power [Ice]

So far, I guess what's come of it in terms of teambuilding with Mega Diancie is that Tornadus-T works very well with her. The bird's offensive pressure is insane, and between the two of them, you should be able to rip holes into pretty much any team. Keldeo also works nicely as a switch in against many things that threaten Mega Dia, mainly Heatran, Bisharp, and Scizor. Also, having a bulky Steel pivot is really important, or at least it has been for me when using Mega Diancie. I've been using Scizor, but Jirachi would also pair well with her I feel like. As a whole, I feel like making the team a bit bulkier and have a different lead would work out well, so the only thing I'd really suggest for you is to definitely try out the Diancie / Keldeo / Tornadus-T core (or at least Mega Dia / Torny-T), and invest in a bulky, but offensively capable, Steel type.
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Old 08-11-2016, 11:42 AM   #18
Talon87
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Sparkbeat's team has so much legend spam it makes even 2016 Talon, with his softened stance on legendary use, cry. :'D But that really is the state of Smogon Gen 6 OU: "the new world order Ubers" or "Ubers, Jr." if you like. And so without further ado, I decided to give it a go.

But not before playing a couple more games with the team I concocted yesterday. I went 2-2 or else 3-2, but either way the two losses stung and were a grim reminder that whatever I was using wasn't cutting it. I mean, "you can't beat everyone" on the one hand, true, but one of those losses was a painful loss to a scrub who was making terribad calls -- the sort which sent me plummeting because they occurred on make-or-break turns. And when something like that happens, you've gotta ask the question -- "Are they terrible plays?" And if the answer's no, you gotta look to yourself and to the team.

So I decided to answer that by trying out Spark's team. I've played two games so far, one with a copy-paste of his team and one with a few slight alterations. Both games, I won handily. 3-0 or 4-0 for the first, and 4-0 for the second. My Elo is now the unimpressive score of 1348, but for the record this is the highest it's been since we started this experiment, and I only expect it to go up from here given how commanding the wins were.

Opponent 1 had: Escavalier, Sylveon, Crobat, Mega Charizard Y, Gastrodon, and ???
Opponent 2 had: Froslass, Shedinja, Mega Sableye, Gengar, Chandelure, and Golurk

Changes made to Spark's team:
- Diancie: replaced HP:Fire for Earth Power
- Tornadus-T: replaced Superpower for U-Turn

HP:Fire vs. Earth Power: In the first game, I decided to try out Mega Diancie's HP:Fire vs. an Escavalier who was at 92% HP. ... It only brought him down to 18% HP. His item was Leftovers, so no Assault Vest shenanigans. I had been pessimistic about HP:Fire to start with but decided to trust in Spark's instincts. But after seeing how poorly it performed against an Escavalier, I decided that was enough and I was done with testing it out.
  • Can't use HP:Fire vs. Scizor because priority Bullet Punch that OHKOes.
  • Can't use HP:Fire vs. Escavalier because doesn't OHKO yet enemy Iron Head does.
  • Can't use HP:Fire vs. Ferrothorn because I'm betting it doesn't OHKO either yet enemy Gyro Ball does.
  • Earth Power OHKOs enemy Heatran (once balloon is popped).
  • Earth Power applies modest pressure to enemy Raikou who want to switch in to Diancie but have seen Earth Power used earlier in the match.
  • Earth Power OHKOs enemy Mega Gengar if you use it the turn they Mega Evolve and you call that correctly.
If some of these items turn out to be wrong (because we're running Spark's physical Diancie instead of Smogon's special Diancie; I prefer physical personally, so I really want Spark's preference to be right <3 ), then I might go back to HP:Fire. But for now, I want Earth Power. For reference, physical Diancie's SpAtk stat is equivalent to Resolute Keldeo's SpAtk stat with full EV investment when Timid. So that's nice. (They're both 357.) So it's not like it's "weak", per se. And I just love the idea of Diamond Storm being her ultimate. X3

Superpower vs. U-Turn: This one's easy:
  • Tornadus-T, as a Regenerator, is all about the momentum. Forcing switches and switching right back out. U-Turn plays beautifully into this strategy. No other move on the set does.
  • Both U-Turn and Superpower offer physical options for damage.
  • We already have physical fighting coverage in Sacred Sword on Keldeo (pseudo-physical) and Close Combat on Terrakion (true physical). I really don't think we need it a third time.
I'll respect Spark's decision to run Superpower but I'm not going to run it myself, not until I see it outperforming U-Turn in terms of overall utility.

That's it for now. Two games really isn't enough basis to justify more changes. I really want to give Spark's team a go with as few changes as possible. I trust in his judgment. I just ... strongly disagree with those two move choices. ^^;; Maybe it's a difference in playstyles. And maybe it's a difference in where we are on the ladder. We'll see.
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Old 08-11-2016, 11:49 AM   #19
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Wait remind me what Grass Knot hits for Torny-T
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:07 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rotomotorz View Post
Wait remind me what Grass Knot hits for Torny-T
Gastrodon ... Rotom-W (poorly) ... Tyranitar ... Hippowdon ... can't think of much else, but these are all pretty decent checks to a Tornadus otherwise. Two resist Hurricane, three resist Heat Wave, none care about U-Turn ... Gastrodon packs Ice Beam, Rotom-W packs Volt Switch or other Electric attacks, Tyranitar of course has Stone Edge, and Hippowdon ... hmm ... well maybe he shouldn't be on this list as a "check," but he's still a valid target for Grass Knot. :p hahaha

Superpower is almost certainly on Spark's set for Tyranitar (who otherwise sets up Dragon Dance on Tornadus-T), but I'm pretty confident in Grass Knot's ability to put Tyranitar within 2HKO range. I suppose where Spark isn't willing to lose Tornadus in that specific match-up, I would be because of the accessible Scarf Keldeo and Band Scizor switch-ins. If Tyranitar stupidly tries to DD twice, he loses to Grass Knot. If he smartly doesn't and instead OHKOs with Stone Edge, you then switch in Pokémon that will still outspeed, in one fashion or another, and secure the KO.

I dunno. We'll see! This team is both a personal and a communal work in progress. We'll all see together what works and what doesn't.
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:19 PM   #21
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180 SpA Life Orb Tornadus-T Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 190-226 (55.7 - 66.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

It'll 2HKO offensive variants. But bulky variants won't be.

180 SpA Life Orb Tornadus-T Grass Knot (120 BP) vs. 248 HP / 180 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 161-192 (39.9 - 47.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:28 PM   #22
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Might replace it for Defog then, especially since I can still U-Turn out the first turn he uses DD for either of Keldeo or Scizor.
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:40 PM   #23
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Smart idea!

Except Tornadus doesn't learn Defog. :p
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Old 08-11-2016, 12:57 PM   #24
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Me using Grass Knot is completely personal and probably not optimal since it's mainly just because bulky Waters make me shit myself in fear. U-Turn or Taunt is probably better, but it does help if I ever run into a stall team with Quagsire or Gastrodon.
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Old 08-11-2016, 05:30 PM   #25
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The only bulky water that should threaten a Torny T is Rotom who literally gets healed by Grass Knot. I mean Gastro maybe but do people really use Gastro anymore?
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