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Old 06-24-2010, 07:47 AM   #1
Mercutio
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Ghosts

G'day,

As has just been shown by the Zora vs Loki match, the Ghost pokémon rules section could use a redress. Some pokémon are not mentioned, some pokémon are merely implied to exist and pretty much nobody even remembers about the 'gaseous' state nowadays.

With this in mind, I took a liberty and rewrote it for all pokémon not included and made a few edits to the existing stuff (italics). Feel free to ignore this or redo it, but I'm quite happy to make changes as suggested if the LOs are happy for me to do so. I had no idea what to do with Rotom so that will be wrong.

Not trying to undermine anyone but I know that you LOs have a life and since I'm sitting in bed at midday it appears that I don't. Thought I'd handle a small job for you.

---

Ghost Pokémon Information

Ghosts. The undead of the Pokémon world. Ghosts have the ability to switch between four 'forms', each having their own advantages and disadvantages.

Solid: What all other Pokémon classify as. Their bodies are solid, and can be harmed and damaged by physical blows.

Ethereal: The 'ghostly' state, the ghost must concentrate to a minimal degree to remain in this form. They are visible, yet all attempts at physical damage pass right through. In this form, although immune to physical, they are now much more susceptible to 'special' attacks than the solid form, and take more (about +50%) damage from them. Ice Beam, Psychic, Shadow Ball etc. Water does not classify as such, despite the game's 'special' classification of it, and will pass through in this state. Ghosts will still take some damage from the 'aura' of a physical attack if it has one. For example, if a ghost is ethereal and is hit by Skull Bash, the attacker will pass right through the ghost but the ghost will take a portion of the damage it would normally receive because of the aura. In this state, ghosts also have the ability to pass through solid objects e.g. pillars, ceilings, floors, so long as they keep moving and are not in solid space for more than five seconds. This means Ghost Pokémon can NOT go and hide underground in the ethereal form, though they can go under momentarily, coming back out a few seconds later for perhaps a surprise attack. While in this state, a ghost may not use any physical attacks and must change to the solid form in order to use them (this will happen automatically if a ghost in this mode is ordered to use a physical attack).

Gaseous: Not quite ethereal, a little closer to solid. Like ethereal, it can't be damaged by physical attacks, but they still produce a little effect, a 'funny feeling' that can become quite distracting if it's a large or fast 'hit'. The Ghost will still take damage from an attack's 'aura' in this state. 'Special' attacks are still more effective than solid, but not quite as bad as ethereal (about +33%). Gaseous ghosts are not capable of passing through walls, but can fit through even the tiniest of gaps, say, a crack or split in a wall. The time it takes to pass through this hole though will depend on it's size, obviously a while for a tiny crack or pinhole. I]While in this state, a ghost may not use any physical attacks and must change to the solid form in order to use them (this will happen automatically if a ghost in this mode is ordered to use a physical attack).[/I]

Invisible: The ghost becomes invisible, and cannot be seen. Although harder to hit because it can't be targeted, it will take damage from most any hit, as it is in its solid state whilst invisible. The invisible form is limited to 2 rounds per ghost per battle. In this mode, only physical moves and mind affecting attacks e.g. Confuse Ray, Hypnosis may be used.


Unless the ghost is ordered to be in a certain state, it remains fluctuating between solid and ethereal/gaseous unless otherwise stated. If it sees a solid/physical attack coming, it will easily become ethereal or gaseous to avoid the damage. Thus, if a 'special' attack is coming at it, it will shift to solid form to minimize the damage, as it is more susceptible to it in ethereal form.

If a ghost is caught by surprise by a physical attack, say, from behind, each of ghost has a different chance of being struck, which is explained in their descriptions (referees should use their own discretion). Surprise special attack chances are the inverse of mentioned physical surprise chances. (e.g. Haunter: 40% chance of physical surprise hit --> 60% of more effective special hit.) The time in ethereal/gaseous is split evenly among the two, so surprise special hits that hit with a damage bonus is half the time +50%, and half the time +33%.

---

Gastly: The only ghost that is in ethereal/gaseous form all the time. It can not attain a solid form except when it becomes invisible. As a trade-off for its near complete physical immunity, it remains slower than most ghosts. Gastly can fly, though it is not as fast or agile as true flying pokémon or other ghosts and cannot fly as high as they can. It can see in the dark.

Haunter: The middle of the three possibly solid ghosts. When not expecting them, physical attacks will most often miss, yet they do have a solid chance of hitting (about 40%). Haunter may go physical in order to use physical attacks but prefers to remain in the ethereal or gaseous modes. Haunter can fly, though it is not as fast or agile as true flying pokémon and cannot fly as high as they can. It can see in the dark.

Gengar: The most solid ghost, and the only one to actually stand on the ground, if this fastest ghost is not flying. His solid form is more dominant at rest (near 66%), and he will more often than not be hit by surprise physical attacks. Gengar can fly, though it is not as fast as true flying pokémon and cannot fly as high as they can. Gengar is, however, exceptionally agile in the air. It can see in the dark.

Misdreavus/Mismagius: Aside from when it desires to be in solid form, it is almost always gaseous (about 85% of the time). Surprise physical attacks will almost always pass through Misdreavus. Misdreavus hovers quite low to the ground unless ordered not to, so when it does lapse into solid form, it can take its share of scratches on rough terrain, especially when moving fast. Misdreavus cannot switch to the ethereal mode. Misdreavus and Mismagius can fly, though they are not as fast or agile as true flying pokémon and cannot fly as high as they can. They can see in the dark.

Shedinja: Shedinja is solid at all times and will always be hit by surprise physical attacks since it is a shell of Nincada when it evolves. However, due to its Wonder Guard ability, Shedinja can only feel those attacks that are super effective against it. For more information on Shedinja, check the Creating a Squad section. Shedninja can fly, though it is not as fast or agile as true flying pokémon and cannot fly as high as they can.

Shuppet/Banette: These Pokemon are in solid form about 85% of the time (the rest of the time, the Pokemon will appear gaseous and cannot enter ethereal mode). These Pokemon always float above ground as high as their trainer is tall and cannot fly much higher than this point, though of course they may go lower. Surprise physical attacks will connect with Shuppet and Banette most of the time (about 85%). These Pokemon, like Misdreavus, cannot pass through solid objects. They can see in the dark.

Sableye: Sableye is in solid form all the time and travels only by walking or running along the ground. Surprise physical attacks will connect with Sableye about 50% of the time. This Pokemon cannot pass through solid objects. It can see in the dark. Note: Because ghosts are not immune to fighting type attacks, Sableye is weak to fighting type moves.

Duskull: Because of its sneaking nature, Duskull will be considered about 40% solid and visible when it is stationary. When it moves, its form becomes ethereal and harder to see and can pass through any object. This makes Duskull appear to teleport from one place to another. Duskull moves slightly faster than Gastly but slower than most other ghosts. Duskull is more likely to be hit by surprise physical attacks while he is stationary (about 50%). Duskull can fly, but cannot go much higher than its trainer's waist level. It can see in the dark.

Dusclops/Dusknoir: Also somewhat ethereal, these pokémon are considered to be more solid standing on the ground (about 60%) than floating in the air (about 50%). These Pokemon can float a few inches off the ground if ordered to do so. They are very slow floaters/movers because of their size and are susceptible to be hit by all special attacks. Surprise physical attacks are more likely to connect with Dusclops while it is on the ground (80%) than it is while he is floating (70%). They can see in the dark.

Drifloon/Drifblim: These Pokemon are in solid form about 85% of the time (the rest of the time, the Pokemon will appear gaseous and cannot enter ethereal mode). Surprise physical attacks will connect with Drifloon and Drifblim most of the time (about 85%). These Pokemon, like Misdreavus, cannot pass through solid objects. Drifblim is considered 'familiar' with Psychic abilities. As flying types, these pokémon move faster than the average ghost, though they can be blown off course by very strong winds.

Spiritomb: Spiritomb's keystone is 100% solid all of the time. Conversely, it's spectral body is always considered ethereal. Spiritomb may withdraw into its keystone at any time, which counts as a move (coming out of the keystone does not count as a move). Should the keystone be destroyed, it will reform within seconds, though such damage will stun Spiritomb for a few seconds. Spiritomb can levitate to a little above human eye level, though prefers to sit on or very close to ground level. It moves slower than most ghosts because it must carry its keystone with it at all times. Spritomb can see in the dark. Note: Because ghosts are not immune to fighting type attacks, Spiritomb is weak to fighting type moves.

Froslass: This Pokemon is in solid form about 85% of the time (the rest of the time, the Pokemon will appear gaseous and cannot enter ethereal mode). It likes to float at human waist level, though it may move from this point. Surprise physical attacks will connect with Froslass most of the time (about 85%). Froslass cannot pass through solid objects. It can see in the dark and can easily see through Blizzards. As a pokémon used to flying through Blizzards, it is faster than the average ghost though it is no more agile, as it is not a true flying type. Froslass's mind affecting moves are 10% more effective than normal.

Rotom: When in normal form, Rotom is considered to be ethereal 60% of the time and solid 40% of the time. Conversely, when in one of its forms, it is considered solid 80% of the time and ethereal the other 20%. Rotom may only go gaseous in normal form and may never go invisible.

---

Additional Information

All ghosts are immune to mentally affecting Psychic moves (sig or not, unless specified it can affect ghost [usually Dark type]) in all forms.

Telekinetic-based Psychic moves (Psychic, Disable) have NO effect on a ghost in the ethereal or invisible state.

Ghosts in the gaseous state are only affected by Disable, and it only reduces its ease of movement by 1/4, or lowering their speed to 3/4 of its original as long as it is held.

Ghosts in the solid state, telekinetic moves are actually somewhat effective. Disable is 3/4 effective, holding its target mostly in place, only allowing minimal movement, 1/4 speed, at great effort from the ghost. Psychic is 1/2 effective, and although the ghost can be moved, in most cases the ghost can counter that force with attempted movement of its own in the opposite direction.

Once a telekinetic move has locked it's effects on a ghost, the ghost can not change states until the opponent releases them.

Hypnosis, Psybeam and Psychic (wave/blast form only) are the only Psychic moves that have regular effects on ghost-type Pokémon.

Last edited by Mercutio; 06-24-2010 at 08:12 AM.
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Old 06-24-2010, 08:11 AM   #2
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Only skimmed through it for now but you should probably mention Psychic wave affects Ghosts.
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Old 06-24-2010, 08:12 AM   #3
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Ta.
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Old 06-24-2010, 10:37 AM   #4
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Don't forget that Rotom is composed of plasma.

Thus, they can flow through ALL electronic devices, but can only posses those with a special motor. When Rotom is in a device, a electrical aura can be seen around the device, and Rotom will take full damage from any physical moves directed at the object. Controversially, all non-electric and non-water special moves will damage the device, rather than Rotom itself (though this can force Rotom to exit the chosen device). Electrical and water special attacks will effect Rotom as normal, whether he is in a device or not. In addition, when in a device other than those with special motors, Rotom loses their electric resistance, and becomes weak to water-type moves.
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 06-24-2010, 10:54 AM   #5
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... what?
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Old 06-24-2010, 10:57 AM   #6
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*Science Fanatic Rant*

Err... Basically, think of Rotom as a living bolt of electricity. >_>
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People should watch what they enjoy regardless of what others think, even if it's a terribad guilty pleasure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:09 AM   #7
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People never said anything bad about me using an ethereal Froslass :x Also Muyo said (through the grapevine) something about Froslass having imperfect invisibility.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:15 AM   #8
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>Someone rewrites Ghost rules
>Doesn't give Shuppet/Banette the ethereal form they've clearly been demonstrated to have

I shall rewrite everything, later, and it shall be glorious.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:33 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZoraJolteon View Post
>Someone rewrites Ghost rules
>Doesn't give Shuppet/Banette the ethereal form they've clearly been demonstrated to have

I shall rewrite everything, later, and it shall be glorious.
This should be the PASBL motto.
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Old 06-24-2010, 01:28 PM   #10
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But "later" in this case means "a few hours" rather than true PASBL "later". Now gaze upon my Ghost rules, and think "For once, I agree with Zora."

Solid

What all other Pokémon classify as. Their bodies are solid, and can be harmed and damaged by physical blows.

Non-solid or Ethereal

The 'ghostly' state, the ghost must concentrate to a minimal degree to remain in this form. They are visible, yet all attempts at physical damage pass right through. In this form, although immune to physical, they are now much more susceptible to 'special' attacks than the solid form, and take more (about +50%) damage from them. Fire, Electricity, non-physical Grass, energy beams, etcetera. Water does not classify as such, despite the game's 'special' classification of it, and will pass through in this state. It also has the ability to pass through walls, roofs, floors, and any obstacle in the arena in this form, so long as they keep moving and are not in solid space for more than five seconds. This means Ghost Pokémon can NOT go and hide underground in the ethereal form, though they can go under momentarily, coming back out a few seconds later for perhaps a surprise attack. Going beyond this limit will result in the Ghost taking rapidly increasing amounts of damage, so it will refuse to obey any orders to do so, but could possibly get trapped in some way.

Gaseous

Not quite ethereal, a little closer to solid. Like ethereal, it can't be damaged by physical attacks, but they still produce a little effect, a 'funny feeling' that can become quite distracting if it's a large or fast 'hit'. 'Special' attacks are still more effective than solid, but not quite as bad as ethereal (about +33%). Gaseous ghosts are not capable of passing through walls, but can fit through even the tiniest of gaps, say, a crack or split in a wall. The time it takes to pass through this hole though will depend on it's size, obviously a while for a tiny crack or pinhole.

Invisible

While not a 'true' state per se, the ghost becomes invisible, and cannot be seen. Although harder to hit because it can't be targeted, it will take damage from most any hit, as it is in its solid state whilst invisible. Taking damage will cause the Ghost to become visible again. The invisible form is limited to 2 rounds per ghost per battle.

As well, attacks are restricted in some states. Invisible, the ghosts can only attack with moves that have no energy element. In ethereal or gaseous, no pure physical attacks can be used.


Each ghost has a preferred state to be in, although they may use a move to shift into one state permanantly, or as long as possible. Shifting back into 'natural' mode does not cost a move, and will also be done automatically when a ghost is instructed to perform a move that cannot be done in their current state. Ghosts in 'natural' mode will automatically shift into the form which will take the lowest amount of damage, should they get enough warning of an incoming attack. While changing states does not consume any notable amount of energy, Ghosts require a brief period of time after changing states before they can do it again.

Ghost-type take neutral damage from Normal-type and Fighting-type attacks.

The majority of Ghost types can float. Those that do so can comfortably hover a few feet off a solid or liquid surface for the duration of any battle. They may also float higher, although the energy cost of doing so rises exponentially with altitude and time.



Gastly: The only ghost that cannot maintain a permanant Solid form, Gastly can only go Solid for a few seconds at a time. However, to compensate for it's vulnerability to special attacks, it is one of the few Ghosts capable of assuming a Gaseous form, which it prefers to stay in. It can also go Ethereal.

Haunter: Capable of achieving all three states, Haunter prefers to be Ethereal. Haunter can keep its hands in a different state to its body, including Invisible.

Gengar: Capable of achieving all three states, Gengar prefers to be Solid.

Misdreavus: Misdreavus can assume an Ethereal or a Solid form, prefering the latter.

Mismagius: Misdreavus can assume an Ethereal or a Solid form, prefering the latter.

Shedinja: Shedinja are permanantly in Solid form. They also have Wonderguard, so see elsewhere (like Zora's ability thread which should be made real)

Sableye: Sableye are permanantly in Solid form.

Shuppet: Shuppet can assume an Ethereal or a Solid form, prefering the former.

Banette: Banette prefer to be in Solid form, but may go Ethereal for about 10 seconds at a time.

Duskull: Duskull can assume an Ethereal or a Solid form, prefering the former.

Dusclops: Dusclops prefer to be in Solid form, but may go Ethereal for about 10 seconds at a time.

Dusknoir: Dusknoir prefer to be in Solid form, but may go Ethereal for about 10 seconds at a time.

Drifloon: Drifloon prefer to be in Solid form, but may go Ethereal for about 10 seconds at a time. While Ethereal, they are forced to float in the Ghost sense, rather than float in the balloon sense.

Drifblim: Drifblim prefer to be in Solid form, but may go Ethereal for about 10 seconds at a time. While Ethereal, they are forced to float in the Ghost sense, rather than float in the balloon sense.

Spiritomb: Spiritomb's Keystone is permanantly Solid. Spiritomb's body is permanantly Ethereal, but may retreat into its Keystone for defense. The Keystone is indestructable, Kush is silly.

Froslass: Froslass can assume an Ethereal or a Solid form, prefering the former.

Rotom: Capable of achieving all three states, Rotom prefers to be gaseous (or plasmatic, as the case may be). Bonded to an appliance, Rotom is locked into Solid form.
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Old 06-24-2010, 01:55 PM   #11
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I have always thought the "Surprise physical attack success %" to be dumb. If a ghost is in a Solid state, it should get hit. If it isn't in a solid state, it should avoid or take greatly reduced damage from those physical attacks. Surprise or not.

Also, Rotom in an appliance forme should be Solid, as the object he possesses is a solid. [/agreeing with ZJ]
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Old 06-24-2010, 02:01 PM   #12
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FYI, through the law of Muyonese Whispers, all 4th Gen Ghosts have imperfect invisibility.

Now that I have reliable internet and a reliable powersource, if I can find a moment, I'll give these a look and possibly write proper ones.

I kinda left this for Muyo because he seems opinionated about it but we'll see.

Also we're probably not going to touch Rotom for now because rules HAVE been written (and even posted somewhere) but Muyo got all weird about them and never approved it or whatever.
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Old 06-24-2010, 02:20 PM   #13
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On mobile so can't read whole of Zora's attempt, but I'm sure mine are superiors etc. Don't seee why Banette shouldn't get ethereal though
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Old 06-24-2010, 02:32 PM   #14
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Also, why write proper ones when you can just nab bits from ours which are both better written than some of the vintage rules?
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Old 06-24-2010, 04:03 PM   #15
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I probably will and just adapt it to be prettier.

And add in a few other rules but yeah.
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Old 06-24-2010, 05:20 PM   #16
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Actually Zora's is cool.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:51 PM   #17
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Jeri wants to write up ghost rules too, so once he's done I'll pick the best of them, tweak it, and we'll be good.
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Old 07-03-2010, 06:46 AM   #18
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Additions to paragraphs:

Under Gaseous:
Only four Pokemon can properly achieve a Gaseous form, Gastly, Haunter, Gengar and Misdreavus.

Gastly
Gastly is essentially living gas, and as such, can never atain solid form (aside from when invisible), and will always be ethereal or gaseous. As a trade-off for its near complete physical immunity, it remains the slowest of all four ghosts.

Haunter
Haunter, while more solid than its preevolution and able to solidify, is composed primarily of gas, and prefers Gaseous or Ethereal over Solid. Haunter's hands can move independently of it and can move with agility and decent speed. They are able to pass through solid objects even when Haunter is Solid or Gaseous, with somewhat more freedom to pass through objects than Haunter itself, allowing them to pass through thicker walls or other objects.

Gengar
Unlike its preevolutions, Gengar is primarily solid, though it is able to freely achieve the other forms. Gengar is the fastest of its line in the air, but can stand on the ground.

Misdreavus
Misdreavus is the only ghost outside of the Gengar line able to achieve Gaseous perfectly. Though not the fastest, Misdreavus can manage a decent speed in the air.

Mismagius
Mismagius is unable to achieve Gaseous, but in exchange, is much nimbler than Misdreavus and can go a fair bit higher without having to expend more energy.

Shedinja
Shedinja is permanently solid, unable to achieve other forms. Unlike the games, Shedinja is not immune to all neutral and resisted attacks attacks, but has a signficant resistance against all non-Super Effective attacks and has less health than normal.

Sableye
Sableye is permanently solid, unable to achieve other forms. Due to Ghost not providing immunity against Fighting attacks, they are considered weak to Fighting.

Shuppet
Shuppet is considered to be Solid by default, though it can become ethereal for decent periods of time.

Banette
Banette is nearly always solid, but can become ethereal for short periods of time.

Duskull
Though it can become solid, Duskull is nearly always ethereal. Though rather slow, it makes up for this with a fantastic ability to hide, able to reside in walls and other solid objects for a little longer than other ghosts and able to pass through thicker walls.

Dusclops
Dusclops is relatively solid and prefers that form, but can go ethereal with little problem. Though it typically stays on the ground, it is able to levitate, though only about as high as Duskull - about knee level of the average trainer, and moves just about as slowly on the ground and in the air.

Dusknoir
Dusknoir is relatively solid and prefers that form, but can go ethereal with little problem. Unlike its earlier forms, it can levitate with decent speed and agility, and can achieve a little more height (about 5 feet).

Drifloon
Drifloon is almost always solid, but able to turn ethereal for short periods of time. They are very nimble in the air but light much like Hoppip and can be blown about easily by winds, but in ethereal, they are not influenced by winds or other similar forces.

Drifblim
Drifloon is almost always solid, but able to turn ethereal for short periods of time. They are very nimble in the air but light much like Hoppip and can be blown about easily by winds, but in ethereal, they are not influenced by winds or other similar forces.

Spiritomb
Spiritomb can never become completely solid, and its body is always ethereal. The keystone which it is bound to is always solid. As a move, Spiritomb may retreat into its keystone for defense or to hide. Spiritomb is still able to pass through walls, but it cannot extend its body more than 5 feet away from the Keystone and, due to the stone's pull, can only pass through walls for a limited amount of time. Despite being weighed down by the Keystone, it is actually very nimble and fast in the air, but it will expend a bit more energy to maintain levitation.

Froslass
Froslass is primarily solid, though it can go ethereal for decent periods of time. Froslass's invisibility is imperfect, always leaving an icy glimmer behind, but it allows it to still hide in dark areas and ice, snow and other white or lightly colored areas.

Rotom
Rotom is considered permananetly in "plasma" form, which most closely resembles Gaseous. However, it can pass through walls in this state and is able to occupy objects for a much longer time than other Ghosts. While occupying an object, it will take full damage from attacks if that object is hit with attacks. Despite these abilities, Rotom cannot stay in walls, floors, or other significant surfaces for any longer than the typical ghost. Bonded to an appliance, Rotom is locked into Solid form.

Notes:
I am not sure about Shedinja but I think it's a decent way to try and make it usable.
I also like this part of Zora's post and think it should be included regardless of whose rules are used.
Surprise attack deals are really stupid and were removed entirely.
Psychic Wave should be added to the "psychic moves that affect ghosts".

Quote:
Each ghost has a preferred state to be in, although they may use a move to shift into one state permanantly, or as long as possible. Shifting back into 'natural' mode does not cost a move, and will also be done automatically when a ghost is instructed to perform a move that cannot be done in their current state. Ghosts in 'natural' mode will automatically shift into the form which will take the lowest amount of damage, should they get enough warning of an incoming attack. While changing states does not consume any notable amount of energy, Ghosts require a brief period of time after changing states before they can do it again.

Ghost-type take neutral damage from Normal-type and Fighting-type attacks.

The majority of Ghost types can float. Those that do so can comfortably hover a few feet off a solid or liquid surface for the duration of any battle. They may also float higher, although the energy cost of doing so rises exponentially with altitude and time.
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Old 07-03-2010, 07:02 AM   #19
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If Misdreavus can go gaseous, why can't Mismagius?
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Old 07-03-2010, 07:03 AM   #20
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Much improved on the current stuff, only minor thing is you've called Dusknoir Dusclops in its description. I'm quite tempted by a Shedinja from that.
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Old 07-03-2010, 07:03 AM   #21
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Because it's faster.

[/idunnolol]

Fix'd, blame lazy copypasta.
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Old 07-03-2010, 07:05 AM   #22
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Nicely done I think the bit about seeing in the dark should be added owing to them being, y'know, ghosts.
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Old 07-03-2010, 09:33 AM   #23
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Misdreavus got trapped under a tree in G/S/C. Why are we assuming it can go gassy now?
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Old 07-03-2010, 10:57 AM   #24
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Because the old rules seemed to like it?

I dunno it seems gas-ish.
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Old 07-03-2010, 02:47 PM   #25
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Misdreavus will be solid or invisible only, since we've actually had a bit of anime evidence for it.

I might like to drop the "gaseous" form all together.
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