UPNetwork  

Go Back   UPNetwork > Independent Forums > PASBL > Suggestions and Inquiries

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 09-04-2014, 06:36 PM   #1
Mercutio
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 14,729
Meowth Economics for Dummiez

So while I'm pointing out that I'm not an LO I may as well get started on the other thing I'm working on, just to make sure that you all get confused and continue to massage my ego, which is apparently a thing that I require from the internet (?).

I'm gradually playing about with the economy and rejigging it to make things more worthwhile to buy whilst also making it so that non item battles are more prominent. Because apparently explicitly saying that you can turn items off in every match is too subtle for you guys.

Broadly speaking these are some of the things we're thinking of that may or may not make it through to the Economy Mk III:

1) Remove trade caps
2) Make all badges and tokens 'worth purchasing'
3) Better differentiation between purchased items and Gym Badges
4) Write up individual historical badges for purchase with appropriate nerfs where needed
5) Make the speciality matches that no-one uses simpler, cooler and more prominent.


What else do you want? This isn't a democracy but I'll leave the thread open for two weeks or until the discussion dries up and then take on board what you say.

For reference, the current economic system is described here.

Last edited by Mercutio; 09-04-2014 at 06:43 PM.
Mercutio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 06:41 PM   #2
Aposteriori
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,540
I have an idea of passive regeneration of SP.

It would be an SP mine. You purchase the SP mine for 50/75/100 SP. It would generate 2 SP weekly/15 days/monthly. Whatever you deem more balanced. If for whatever reason you have to go on an extended hiatus, you can still generate a nominal amount of revenue.

The main site already notes that gym badges cannot be stolen/nullified by item stealing moves.

Quote:
Item Moves - Moves that steal (e.g. Thief, Covet), trade (e.g. Trick, Switcheroo) or dispose of (e.g. Knock Off) items in-game can be used to affect attachable tokens or badges. These moves can only be used once per Pokémon, per move (e.g. a Pokémon can Trick a token on the foe then Knock it Off, but cannot Trick tokens back twice). With the exception of Knock Off, stealing token or item effects last for five rounds before they're returned or the effects wear off. These moves cannot affect Mega Tokens or Badges.
Aposteriori is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 06:50 PM   #3
Mercutio
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 14,729
That is presumably an example of Jeri not actually thinking his policies through again.
Mercutio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 06:56 PM   #4
Zelphon
Happy October
 
Zelphon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: A Broken Mind
Posts: 2,146
Send a message via Skype™ to Zelphon
How about removing the conversion cap for TL6 trainers? It wouldn't have a huge effect on the league & as it stands the few people of that status have nothing better to do with their TP.
__________________
Life, but a series of paths and flows
Down many one can go
May yours run smoothly and be soft to your feet

Zelphon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:00 PM   #5
The O
Boulder Badge
 
The O's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Training IN THE MOUNTAINS
Posts: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zelphon View Post
How about removing the conversion cap for TL6 trainers? It wouldn't have a huge effect on the league & as it stands the few people of that status have nothing better to do with their TP.
If I remember correctly, going below the TP requirement for your current level de-levels you. At least I think I saw that somewhere before.
__________________

My Squad and Stats


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveTheFishGuy View Post
wat skool
Quote:
Originally Posted by The O View Post
wat skool
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kairne View Post
wat skool
The O is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:00 PM   #6
Emi
ACHILLESSSSS
 
Emi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Agartha
Posts: 11,153
Send a message via Skype™ to Emi
I brought it up on Skype, but I think the idea of things scaling in one direction is a good thing to implement. For a variety of reasons, not everyone can ref at the scale Mew the Gato or Connor does. Now a good portion of it is that people are lazy, but people also have lives. It's far easier to come up with 25 SP than 45. That might seem obvious to some people, but its simply more difficult because you have to increase your reffing bulk in order to feasibly buy 6 slots every time. Which isn't feasible for most people. In addition, it allows people to not have to worry about fluctuations in their reffing (such as school and what not) to impact their ability to ASB.

So my recommendation is this: allow people to buy lower packs of slots that don't affect the prices of higher packs. There really isn't much abuse to the system that can be generated while still allowing people to ref at their own pace. At this point, there isn't much of a reason not to buy packs at 45 SP. But if you can buy a 25 SP pack without it increasing the price of the 45 SP one, there is an incentive not to wait. However, the reverse should never apply. If someone buys a 45 SP pack, it should affect the lower ones.

Note: I am horrible at articulation so this probably is garble.
__________________


Quote:
Zelphon - Today at 5:29 AM
If the current political climate has taught me anything
It's that a purge via gay witches may very well be necessary
Emi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:03 PM   #7
Connor
Who Knows?
 
Connor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,984
But then I begin to abuse this by buying cost effective, lower priced slots. If you then say that having capped out your 6 pack slots effects your lower priced slots, yt also poses a problem for those who have already raised the price of the higher cost packs.
__________________
Connor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:05 PM   #8
Emi
ACHILLESSSSS
 
Emi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Agartha
Posts: 11,153
Send a message via Skype™ to Emi
That's how abuse is prevented. Because you maxxed out your cap prices on the higher packs, you maxxed out your cap prices on the lower ones. If that's already the case...oh well. You could reset prices but that would cause more problems than it solves.
__________________


Quote:
Zelphon - Today at 5:29 AM
If the current political climate has taught me anything
It's that a purge via gay witches may very well be necessary
Emi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:08 PM   #9
Zelphon
Happy October
 
Zelphon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: A Broken Mind
Posts: 2,146
Send a message via Skype™ to Zelphon
Quote:
Originally Posted by The O View Post
If I remember correctly, going below the TP requirement for your current level de-levels you. At least I think I saw that somewhere before.
I don't know about that but I do believe TL6s still get TP from battle.
__________________
Life, but a series of paths and flows
Down many one can go
May yours run smoothly and be soft to your feet

Zelphon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:13 PM   #10
Connor
Who Knows?
 
Connor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,984
Yeah but some people have managed to referee enough despite these kinds of drawbacks and increased the cost of their higher priced packs. Your system doesn't take into account how a person may be disadvantaged later on after having a short stint of being able to referee loads. Bluntly saying 'oh well' doesn't escape the fact that your proposed system may well harm the people it's intending to help more than it actually helps them. I mean honestly I'm all for the caps being looked at because it's draining to see 60 SP disappear every time I get new slots, but I don't think this is the best way of going about it.
__________________
Connor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:15 PM   #11
The O
Boulder Badge
 
The O's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Training IN THE MOUNTAINS
Posts: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zelphon View Post
I don't know about that but I do believe TL6s still get TP from battle.
Yeah, they do.

As far as regenerating SP...it's called a Service Point because you provide a service, right? Unless the SP "mine" you buy has a limited amount in it, of course.

As far as price caps, I think they're good as is. Not everyone can have a Dave-squad.

...Or can they?
__________________

My Squad and Stats


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveTheFishGuy View Post
wat skool
Quote:
Originally Posted by The O View Post
wat skool
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kairne View Post
wat skool
The O is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:17 PM   #12
Connor
Who Knows?
 
Connor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,984
You say that now but for some perspective every pack of 6 squad slots I buy costs more than the Legend Challenge I recently purchased.
__________________
Connor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:22 PM   #13
Emi
ACHILLESSSSS
 
Emi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Agartha
Posts: 11,153
Send a message via Skype™ to Emi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Connor View Post
Yeah but some people have managed to referee enough despite these kinds of drawbacks and increased the cost of their higher priced packs. Your system doesn't take into account how a person may be disadvantaged later on after having a short stint of being able to referee loads. Bluntly saying 'oh well' doesn't escape the fact that your proposed system may well harm the people it's intending to help more than it actually helps them. I mean honestly I'm all for the caps being looked at because it's draining to see 60 SP disappear every time I get new slots, but I don't think this is the best way of going about it.
It doesn't disadvantage them any more than the current system, but allows them to increase the size of their squad without having to worry about always getting the biggest pack because anything else isn't worthwhile.
__________________


Quote:
Zelphon - Today at 5:29 AM
If the current political climate has taught me anything
It's that a purge via gay witches may very well be necessary
Emi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:23 PM   #14
The O
Boulder Badge
 
The O's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Training IN THE MOUNTAINS
Posts: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Connor View Post
You say that now but for some perspective every pack of 6 squad slots I buy costs more than the Legend Challenge I recently purchased.
Legends might be quite strong, but that's still essentially getting 6 new Pokemon vs. maybe getting 1 stronger Pokemon.

6 is pretty much an entire new squad. It should be expensive.
__________________

My Squad and Stats


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveTheFishGuy View Post
wat skool
Quote:
Originally Posted by The O View Post
wat skool
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kairne View Post
wat skool
The O is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:31 PM   #15
Stealthy
A New and Original Person
 
Stealthy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 949
Enhancing the mart so there's something besides Squad Slots, Holiday Tokens, Mega Stones, and the occasional Brawler's Token to purchase sounds grand. Making reffing badge not a waste of text sounds cool.

And general note: Cibbir and Dave are the exceptions, not the rule. We should be looking at the average ASB purchaser for how this economy should work; we can make some considerations for them to prevent them from breaking the Mart, but that's about it. As case studies they're about as useful as I am. Shape the baseline system, then look to fix for the extreme scenarios.
Stealthy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 07:34 PM   #16
Sneaze
#SWAG
 
Sneaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sigs Hell
Posts: 5,654
Send a message via Skype™ to Sneaze
Honestly the easiest way to deal with the price caps is to simply have them each have their own scaling price caps. That way if you buy a single slot for 10 SP it doesn't affect anything else but the single slot will still scale up to 15 SP and so on until it caps at 25 SP and you should probably be moving up to three slots starting at 25 SP and capping at 40 SP and then six slots starting at 45 SP and capping at 60 SP. This way alternately you can start at the high end and once you cap that at 60 you can alternately buy cheaper slots for the lower slot packs.

The obvious problem with this being that people suck at keeping records and will easily get confused as to what slot packs cost them how much.
__________________
Wild Future - FizzBy
PASBL - Ghost Grass Gym Leader - Dragon Elite Four


Daisy wins at life for making this Battle Cut
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerichi View Post
Whatever Sneasel says is right
Sneaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2014, 08:54 PM   #17
Jerichi
本✚能
 
Jerichi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: 蒸気の波の中
Posts: 14,491
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercutio View Post
That is presumably an example of Jeri not actually thinking his policies through again.
No, I've thought about it and talked it through with Dave. Badges are still off the table and it's for a reason.

Also no SP mines. That defeats the purpose of SP in the first place.

Additionally, I'm gonna go on the record as saying I don't really like the way we do squad slots. I get the intent to keep people from buying slots and only slots, but it seems like just sort of a cop-out to force us to spend our SP elsewhere. There's a reason why slots are so popular: they're easily the best thing you can buy. We shouldn't have to discourage people from buying something; it just means that the rest of our stuff is disproportionatly useless. I think if we're gonna make it expensive to buy slots, we should just make an initial one-time bulk pack you can buy for a discounted rate (though still fairly expensive overall) and then have any additional at a normal rate in fixed packs.

Last edited by Jerichi; 09-04-2014 at 09:04 PM.
Jerichi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 02:45 AM   #18
Mercutio
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 14,729
Ok so lots of different thoughts on squad slots. I agree that we're punishing the market from the wrong direction on that score so changing the incentive and limit balance is definitely a priority. Relative as well as absolute usefulness is necessary.

What else?
Mercutio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 02:48 AM   #19
Schadenfreude
Volcano Badge
 
Schadenfreude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Bar-hopping with Notorious RBG
Posts: 2,263
Send a message via Skype™ to Schadenfreude
Letting us know about specific dates and time for sales would be nice. Kinda like Black Friday or the Steam Sales. It would give us adequate warning to stock-up, and know when which token will go on sale, or when the nearest half-price slots are coming up. ^___^

Also, I heartily agree with Kush's 5th point. Cheaper Reediculous and Exhibition matches would be nice. Triples come to mind, as do challenges of ridiculous scenarios like Dave's squad of 6 vs one Mew controlled Jeri.
Schadenfreude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 02:52 AM   #20
Shuckle
Mage of Mind
 
Shuckle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Land of Thought and Melody
Posts: 3,104
When you go around making things more worth getting, consider lowering SP costs rather than increasing token effectiveness. A 5 SP type booster isn't worth it and will never be worth it, but a 3SP type booster might be. Also, the Scarves have absolutely no reason to cost 5SP. Just make them 1SP. The Mart could stand to have a few 1SP options for new refs who just finished a match and want to see what they can do with their new cash.
__________________

Spoiler: show
[The Sorcerer's Ambition]A handy link, to be sure.
Level Acquisitions, sorted by level instead of name.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phoopes View Post
Shuckle's awesomeness level continues to rise.
Shuckle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 07:00 AM   #21
Kindrindra
大事なのは自分らしいくある事
 
Kindrindra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Determined
Posts: 5,835
Actually, the type-boosting tokens are very much worth it for those who know how to use them.

On the flip side, why do we even have scarves in the first place. Providing a 'boost' of any sort kinda defeats the entire point of contests.
__________________
PASBL(TL: 4 RL: B-) --- FB (Kin Blackstone) --- WF (Adelie Fleur)
Quote:
Originally Posted by captainmisato View Post
People should watch what they enjoy regardless of what others think, even if it's a terribad guilty pleasure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
Kindrindra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 07:05 AM   #22
Connor
Who Knows?
 
Connor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,984
Type Tokens function as a passive boosting move which doesn't affect all of your attacks. They are very much so not really worth it.
__________________
Connor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 07:23 AM   #23
DaveTheFishGuy
Primordial Fishbeast
 
DaveTheFishGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 12,257
Send a message via Skype™ to DaveTheFishGuy
>Advance notice on sales

But then it's not a surprise!
DaveTheFishGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 07:29 AM   #24
Sneaze
#SWAG
 
Sneaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sigs Hell
Posts: 5,654
Send a message via Skype™ to Sneaze
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerichi View Post
No, I've thought about it and talked it through with Dave. Badges are still off the table and it's for a reason.

Also no SP mines. That defeats the purpose of SP in the first place.

Additionally, I'm gonna go on the record as saying I don't really like the way we do squad slots. I get the intent to keep people from buying slots and only slots, but it seems like just sort of a cop-out to force us to spend our SP elsewhere. There's a reason why slots are so popular: they're easily the best thing you can buy. We shouldn't have to discourage people from buying something; it just means that the rest of our stuff is disproportionatly useless. I think if we're gonna make it expensive to buy slots, we should just make an initial one-time bulk pack you can buy for a discounted rate (though still fairly expensive overall) and then have any additional at a normal rate in fixed packs.
You really might want to rewrite that descript, then, Jeri, seeing as it says they affect badges and then says they don't affect badges all within the confines of the same two lines.
__________________
Wild Future - FizzBy
PASBL - Ghost Grass Gym Leader - Dragon Elite Four


Daisy wins at life for making this Battle Cut
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerichi View Post
Whatever Sneasel says is right
Sneaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2014, 07:33 AM   #25
Jerichi
本✚能
 
Jerichi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: 蒸気の波の中
Posts: 14,491
That's my bad then.
__________________


気紛れを 許して 今更なんて思わずに急かしてよ
もっと中迄入って あたしの衝動を 突き動かしてよ

asbwffb

[jerichi]
Jerichi is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   UPNetwork > Independent Forums > PASBL > Suggestions and Inquiries


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:55 PM.


Design By: Miner Skinz.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.