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Old 09-03-2014, 09:36 PM   #51
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But I mean, my Porygon sig for example has a heightened chance of confusing inorganic pokemon, under current conditions a Banette should not technically have an increased confusion chance.

Now I of course recognize Ghosts have a resistance to mental effects I'm simply using this as an example.

Connor also has a sig on his Quilfish that poisons inorganics as another example.
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Old 09-03-2014, 09:40 PM   #52
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*facepalm*

It does not need to be specified because its obvious. If it cannot be poisoned, its inorganic. Ghosts cannot be poisoned.

Hence they are inorganic. Simple enough for you?
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Old 09-03-2014, 09:46 PM   #53
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We have two groups who share the same benefits but are still separate groups. Unless we have a statement saying that both groups should be considered interchangeable we can't treat them as though they are.

And if we do that sigs that specifically target ghost types would then also target inorganics, then of course we also run into the area where a gym could be loosely based on Ghost types or Inorganics & freely include pokemon from either group.

I realize from a standard battle standpoint they are the same, but when we get down to the nitty gritty where Sigs/Gyms are potentially involved don't you think it pays off to be a little anal about things?
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Old 09-03-2014, 09:47 PM   #54
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All Ghosts are considered inorganic unless otherwise specified. Not the other way around
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Old 09-03-2014, 09:48 PM   #55
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No that's completely wrong. That's like saying a law that affects squares affects rectangles. Ghosts are part of inorganics. Almost all Ghosts are inorganics but not all inorganics are ghosts.
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Old 09-03-2014, 09:49 PM   #56
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We have two groups who share the same benefits but are still separate groups. Unless we have a statement saying that both groups should be considered interchangeable we can't treat them as though they are.

And if we do that sigs that specifically target ghost types would then also target inorganics, then of course we also run into the area where a gym could be loosely based on Ghost types or Inorganics & freely include pokemon from either group.

I realize from a standard battle standpoint they are the same, but when we get down to the nitty gritty where Sigs/Gyms are potentially involved don't you think it pays off to be a little anal about things?
Correct me if I'm wrong but I think it goes something like:

>All Ghosts are inorganic (unless specified)
>Not all inorganics are ghosts

So I mean, if a sig targets ghosts, it wouldn't apply to all inorganics. But if a sig targets inorganics, it would definitely apply to inorganic ghosts.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:12 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by rotomotorz View Post
All Ghosts are considered inorganic unless otherwise specified. Not the other way around
Do you have a link to an official statement that says this?
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:15 PM   #58
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All Ghosts are pretty much inorganic unless specifically noted in their SC.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:16 PM   #59
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Quote:
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All Ghosts are pretty much inorganic unless specifically noted in their SC.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:24 PM   #60
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So then we should all ref inorganic targeting sigs as working on Ghosts?
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:26 PM   #61
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Yes. The only exceptions are Sableye and the Frillish line because they can be poisoned and so forth are not inorganic.

This was not hard.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:30 PM   #62
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That's pretty logic defying but OK. I look forward to some sort of "Virus attack messes up the systems of inorganic targets" sig somehow effecting a Trevenant or Gengar.

But if the system works that way so be it.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:44 PM   #63
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See, if there were a sig like that, it would also affect pokemon made out of pure rock like Gigalith, anyways. Inorganic =/= computer-like, at all.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:49 PM   #64
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An idea just struck me while I was decanting fluids in the laboratory. An interesting and subtle theme for the Oddish line.



If Bellosom is themed after the sun, does that mean Vileplume is patterned after the moon? Further evidence provides credence to this theory.



Oddish learns Moonlight via Level up at Lv33. Gloom learns Moonlight via Level up at Lv41. And strikingly, Karen has a Vileplume in nearly all of games, as part of her "Night/Darkness" team, which implies that Vileplume is very much nocturnal. Her Vileplume actually has Moonlight as a move, I believe.

What I propose is that Vileplume/Gloom/Oddish receive some sort of boost under natural moonlight, due to their nocturnal characteristics. Perhaps Oddish/Gloom/Vileplume are more "enthusiastic" when exposed to moonlight and passively regain energy when exposed to the moon. After all, the canon evidence points to suggest that if Bellossom enjoys sunlight, Vileplume is more active at night. And energy regeneration under moonlight would help.

Also, perhaps Oddish/Gloom/Vileplume do not need to use Fairy type-energy when they use Moonlight. If that is an element of their SC, they wouldn't have to waste precious Fairy energy that they could use for Dazzling Gleam.

Thoughts? It'd improve the Vileplume line and draw an interesting parallelism to Bellossom. Please let me know if you think that I'm just sniffing the crack or something. ^____^;;
Any thoughts on this? Please let me know if you think I'm huffing gasses or something.
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Old 09-03-2014, 10:53 PM   #65
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Wait.

Moonlight uses Fairy energy!?

Otherwise that's pretty sound although passive energy regeneration is a bit much imo
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Old 09-03-2014, 11:06 PM   #66
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Wait.

Moonlight uses Fairy energy!?

Otherwise that's pretty sound although passive energy regeneration is a bit much imo
Yeah, Moonlight uses Fairy energy, making it practically a useless move on Vileplume who kinda relies on Dazzling Gleam to have an actual off-type. The passive regeneration can work out, if the amount of energy regained is quite small. Perhaps a minor or light amount, with the caveat that it stacks with Harvestor/Sunny Day effects and that the Vileplume line gain the positive effects of sunlight from moonlight too. The idea of nocturnal enthusiasm/doesn't-use-Fairy-energy-for-Moonlight/passive energy regeneration under moonlight and treating moonlight like sunlight would give Vileplume a nice parallelism to Bellossom, imo.

Look at this fanart of a Vileplume:

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Old 09-04-2014, 12:08 AM   #67
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Now that's an idea. It being able to use moonlight as sunlight seems pretty cool, and moonlight is just reflected sunlight, after all.
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As may be expected though, our clear winner here was Kairne, ASB's champion of prioritizing the pokemon you like over those that are objectively better. I mean, one of his mains is a Watchog.
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Old 09-04-2014, 10:36 AM   #68
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With that being said, may I suggest a clause that either states explicitly that Moonlight can only be used at night or a clause that explicitly says that refs may have it working (less well?) if they want?

On that note I agree with the Vileplume moon boost thing in the other thread if only because Vileplume is crap.
Success! Maybe Vileplume will finally have a reason to use Moonlight without fearing the loss of Dazzling Gleam and will find a niche for being a night-time specialist. Nocturnal enthusiasm/Moonlight-doesn't-cost-Fairy-energy/passive-regeneration-under-moonlight would allow Vileplume to function as Bellossom's counterpart. While Vileplume might be like every other Grass-type in strong sunlight, she excels under the light of the moon like no other.
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Old 09-04-2014, 10:39 AM   #69
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I like it, but I'm not in charge of SCs anymore!
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Old 09-04-2014, 05:32 PM   #70
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See, if there were a sig like that, it would also affect pokemon made out of pure rock like Gigalith, anyways. Inorganic =/= computer-like, at all.
>If there were
Oh fuck off Kin
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Old 09-04-2014, 05:59 PM   #71
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Can we perhaps give Umbreon some of these proposed Vileplume buffs? Because Umbreon's the Moon Pokemon and Moonlight is, like, their signature attack. Please? Kush?
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People should watch what they enjoy regardless of what others think, even if it's a terribad guilty pleasure.
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 09-04-2014, 06:11 PM   #72
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The LOs are in charge I don't know why you're lobbying me.
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Old 09-04-2014, 07:18 PM   #73
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Because you still act as an LO, do LO duties, use LO powers, and all around are an LO in all but official title.
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As may be expected though, our clear winner here was Kairne, ASB's champion of prioritizing the pokemon you like over those that are objectively better. I mean, one of his mains is a Watchog.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneezey12 View Post
KAIRNE I WILL RIP OFF YOUR SCROTUM AND FEED IT TO YOU THROUGH A FUCKING SWIRLY STRAW.
Leader of the "Stop Screwing Over Smeargle" Brigade

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Art by Kairne
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[URL="http://forums.upnetwork.net/showthread.php?t=4387"]
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Old 09-04-2014, 07:26 PM   #74
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But didn't you say you were commisioned to do the SCs with Dave?

What, no, not trying to gather supporters of the make-Umbreon-good project, what are you talking about?
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People should watch what they enjoy regardless of what others think, even if it's a terribad guilty pleasure.
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 09-04-2014, 07:27 PM   #75
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I was on contract work. That contract ended.
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