UPNetwork  

Go Back   UPNetwork > General Forums > Anime
Register FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-25-2011, 08:53 PM   #1
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Rozen Maiden


Sakurada Jun was once praised as the smartest boy in school. But Jun quits going to school altogether after something traumatic happens to him. Lonely and depressed, he spends his days and nights at home, browsing the Internet and purchasing random items of the Occult. One day, he completes an order form for a wind-up doll and places it in his desk drawer as instructed. Soon afterward, a large wooden chest appears in his bedroom. He checks his desk drawer but the order form he had placed in there moments before has vanished.

Jun opens the wooden chest and discovers Shinku, a beautiful doll dressed in crimson. She comes to life and tells Jun that she is the fifth Rozen Maiden, the fifth in a line of dolls crafted by Rozen, a legendary master craftsman who lived nearly a century ago and was seeking to create the perfect doll: Alice.

Shinku informs Jun that none of Rozen's works ever achieved the perfection he sought in Alice. However, each Rozen Maiden has the potential to become Alice if she wins the Alice Game. Jun soon discovers that the Alice Game is a dark, deadly ritual in which the dolls must destroy one another and claim one another's Rosa Mystica - the magic which embues the dolls with life. The doll who acquires all of the other Rosae Mysticae will become Alice. But is perfection worth the price?

When Jun's life is threatened by one of the dolls partaking in the Alice Game, Shinku offers Jun an ultimatum: either he can die or else he can become Shinku's medium, the magical reservoir which provides a Rozen Maiden with magical powers, and she will save him. Jun's reluctant acceptance marks the beginning of his service to Shinku, a service which will end either with her death ... or with his.

Rozen Maiden is an enchanting tale which explores the meaning of what it is to be imperfect and shows us how the quest for perfection may be what either drives us or destroys us.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 08:54 PM   #2
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Characters:
Disclaimer: this list was written based on the anime version only. It was written based on Season 1 only. It was also written so as to minimize spoilers even for Season 1.

Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 09:13 PM   #3
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Review:
Note: scores have been updated to October 2011 standards and impressions.

Plot: 8/10. For only twelve episodes, Rozen Maiden does a remarkable 9/10 job at developing the plot (which largely ties into the characters). However, for a series as a whole, I would want to give it a 8/10, simply because they do not resolve a scene they show at the very beginning of the series.

Characters: 9/10. Sadly, there aren't many characters. However, this series is only twelve episodes long so what do you expect!? Half of the episodes are "meet a new character", and all twelve episodes involve massive character development. Several facets of "womanhood" are symbolized by each of the Rozen Maidens, and it's done very well.

Animation: 10/10 for when it aired, 8/10 or 9/10 for 2011. "I have not seen a series with such beautiful character design and background/setting design since .hack//SIGN," I wrote back in 2005. "We get to see Jun's apartment, Jun's school, Jun's dream, Hina's dream, Suigin Tou's dream, and Shinku's dream, among other locales. The characters offer even more wonderful design, in hair, clothes, and accessories." All of this is still true. What Rozen Maiden may now lack in technical detail, it more than makes up for in artistic quality.

Music: 8.5/10. When I first saw the series, I gave this a 7/10 and felt that aside from a few battle tunes the soundtrack was overall ho-hum. Yet this cannot be correct as Rozen Maiden's OST is probably one of my most-listened to or most-hummed in the shower soundtracks ever. Particularly memorable tunes include Bara no Jubai (one of the songs that plays in many of Shinku's battles against Suigin Tou), Alice Game (Suigin Tou's "theme", if you will), and Shukuteki (another of the songs that plays in many of Shinku's battles against Suigin Tou). But then there are also the other memorable songs from Rozen Maiden: the ones that come to us from the comedy side of things. Songs like Jaaku na Takurami (from the infamous episode "Die Treppe") and Kanshaku (Hina Ichigo's "theme", if you will) are just as unforgettable.

Replay Value: 7.5/10. Sadly, while Rozen Maiden is a great show, so much of its appeal relies on the answers to certain mysteries, and once you know those ... well .... That stated, the series is still quite pleasant to re-experience, particularly if you really enjoyed it the first time around.

Overall: 9/10. A fantastic series with a few flaws. One of my favorite series I've ever seen. It's not for everyone; but for those for whom it does resonate, it'll resonate strongly and have you scrabbling for Season 2.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 09:27 PM   #4
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Thoughts: a few short quasi-essays

WARNING: The contents of this post must not be read unless you have already completed the series. Under no circumstances should you expand the spoiler tags unless you've seen all three seasons. "Spoiler" really does mean spoiler! ^^;

Essay 1: On the Dominant Theme of the First Season
Spoiler: show
Rozen Maiden has several themes. The dominant theme, one which is spelled out for slowpokes like me towards the end of the series, is the concept of "junk" or the more abstract "worthlessness". Many people consider themselves worthless. They see others around them who can do the things which they aspire to do, people who can do these things far better than they could ever hope to. It's easy to lose hope and fall into despair.

Jun:
This is precisely what happens for our main character, Sakurada Jun. He was a promising student, with 100% scores on all of his tests; but when he failed a national exam, he abandoned high school altogether out of shame. In Rozen Maiden, everybody has a dream(1) which reflects their deepest, darkest feelings. Jun's dream is a world filled with mountains made up of broken PC monitors. The trees have shattered television sets and PC towers hanging on them, like a grotesque Christmas tree. There are papers with his grades on them, plastered to the pavement of the streets that run through his world. All of this wonderful artistic design is an attempt to convey the point that Jun thinks he is worthless; and that such thoughts of "being junk" manifest themselves in his heart.

Shinku:
Shinku, Jun's doll and master, aspires to become Alice, a human girl who is the embodiment of perfection, but she must deal with the reality that she was in fact created to be Alice, but was a failure (to be precise, the fifth failure).

Suigin Tou:
The series' antagonist, Suigin Tou, is the best development of the "worthlessness" theme. I have mentioned Jun's dream, a world filled with "human junk"; for Suigin Tou, the doll equivalent is shown. Hers is a world with broken-down buildings, a world where broken dolls litter the gringy streets, a world where the sun never shines. Suigin Tou is an imperfect doll -- master Rozen never finished her, and she is without a torso. Desperate to win her Father's love, Suigin Tou will do *ANYTHING* to gather all of the Rosae Mysticae and become Alice. As Shinku says in episode 12,

Suigin Tou wanted Father's love and tried to become Alice.
On that feeling alone, she acted without a medium.
Her feelings for Father may have been purer than anyone else's.
But that became a dangerous weapon.

Suigin Tou often calls the other dolls "junk" in the beginning of the series, no doubt playing upon their emotions and the reality that all of them are failed projects, failures to achieve Alice. However, she is much like the gay bully who calls others "faggot" when he in fact is grappling with his own homosexuality. After all, Suigin Tou is the biggest piece of junk of them all. She doesn't even have a torso. It is towards the end of the series that we see this phobia catching up with her, when Shinku is able to strike a nerve and get the dark antagonist of Rozen Maiden to scream, "I AM NOT JUNK!"

1 - by dream, I am referring to the series' concept that every spirit has a "dream" which reflects the inner state of their heart. It does not reflect what one wishes for, but rather what one is feeling in his or her heart. Do not confuse this with REM sleep dreams or with aspirations for the future. Think of it more like "a state of mind", but more precisely "a state of heart".

Essay 2: a small blurb about how the romance in Rozen Maiden is very ehhhhhhhh
(Note: thankfully, this is all but done away with in Season 2.)
Spoiler: show
The show touches on romance several times, but never develops any of these romances satisfactorily. The first we discover is Nori's overaffection towards her younger brother. In episode 10, a humorous line belies what may be some of Nori's true feelings for her little brother. As if this wasn't iffy enough, Jun develops a crush on Shinku that evolves into love, and Shinku comes to love Jun as well. Never mind that she's a two-foot-tall doll that is not anatomically perfect and that he's a human teen. This romance is more disturbing considering that Shinku never absolves Jun of his service to her. The series ends with him remaining "her loyal, loving slave." Uhh ... so, how about the only comfortable romance in the series? This is between Jun and his classmate, Tomoe. However, it is never developed beyond episode 7. I would not suggest watching Rozen Maiden for the romance for two reasons -- there isn't a lot of it, and what little is there is questionable in taste.

Note: in Season 2, Jun x Tomoe is really played up. Jun's relationship with Shinku evolves into one where Jun is more or less a surrogate father for her in the absence of Rozen himself.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 09:58 PM   #5
lilboocorsola
Dragon's Tears
 
lilboocorsola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Searching for light
Posts: 6,471
Oh, it's only 12 episodes? Sounds good, maybe I'll go ahead and check it out then- wait, there's three seasons? =x

Sousei Seki sounds familiar for some reason.... *opens artwork folder to find it was the username of a GaiaOnline character request she drew* Well, that was random.
lilboocorsola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 10:56 PM   #6
Doppleganger
我が名は勇者王!
 
Doppleganger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Emina Isle
Posts: 14,199
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
Ouverture is the third, but I may have blotted my memory of it, because I can't recall any details.

Souseiseki has the same CV as Kokoro from Remember11. Aside from being tomboyish, her super feminine sister is way more appealing and famous. Suiseiseki is the source of the omnipervasive meme, "desu".

I like Suigintou. Talon likes her because she's got this seductress act going on, but deep down she's such a pure soul, it's hard to not like her over the snooty Shinku.

I remember Talon once posted this picture of Suigintou in a state of anxiety/uncertainty and was all "look at her! ;_;". Yeah, I did.
__________________
あなたの勇気が切り開く未来
ふたりの想いが見つけだす希望
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
永遠を抱きしめて
Doppleganger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2011, 11:19 PM   #7
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
Talon likes her because she's got this seductress act going on
No, she doesn't; and no, I don't.

(spoilers thru Season 2 Episode 6)
(spoilers thru Season 2 Episode 6)
Spoiler: show
To quote myself from my "Thoughts" section of the website for Rozen Maiden: Ouverture:
I think that when most people first watch Rozen Maiden, they think of Suigin Tou as "this incredibly nasty and well-written villainess" up until the final episode. And then in the final episode, as if by magic, we find out what it is that Suigin Tou has been hiding for so long ... why it is that her world is filled with broken dolls and rundown buildings ... why she becomes enraged when Shinku calls her "junk," and why she constantly refers to others as junk. And this one revelation suddenly transforms Suigin Tou from a perfectly nasty villain into a perfectly beautiful and tragic character, a "villain" you suddenly find yourself rooting for, and even wishing she would win the Alice Game.

This mentality seems to be pretty commonplace amongst Rozen Maiden fans, and it was a happy surprise (although predicted hopefully by all) when Suigin Tou made her return in the middle of Season 2. Fans were now reunited with their "tragic villain" heroine, their beloved Suigin Tou who is so pitiable and yet so courageous and strong. And they were given quite a nice bit of character development of Suigin Tou's character in Season 2, particularly in ways that would not have been explorable in Season 1 due to Suigin Tou's role as primary villain in that season.
So you're pretty much way off base. Love her because she's a seductress? Uh, no? Yeah, it's true, I love a good seductress, but Suigin Tou isn't that -- and neither is it why I love her. (How could I love her for being something she isn't even in the first place? ) I love her because she's the perfect boomerang from "the evil villain you just love to hate" to "the sympathetic villain you find yourself rooting for." Because she was just so bad throughout the bulk of Season 1, the plot twist at the end of Season 1 is just that much stronger: the revelation that she calls others junk because she herself is junk and she has a huge inferiority complex, along with the fact that she loved Father so strongly and so much more than any of the other dolls, is an even bigger whammo due to her having been so nasty previously. It's kind of like the plot twist takes a negative number and makes it a positive one, and the wow factor derived from this process is the absolute change. So go from -1 to +1 and you move 2 spaces. But go from -10 to +10 and you go a whopping 20 spaces. Suigin Tou is like that. She's in -10 "damn, girl, you bad!" territory. And then she's catapulted into +10 "d'awwwwwwwwww ;_;" territory. You gotta love her. You just gotta.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 03:49 PM   #8
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
So, I've decided to embark upon the adventure of catching up with all things Rozen Maiden. With regards to the original manga, I've only ever read as far as Volume 4. I tried to start from the beginning some time last year or the year before that but I got busy with school-related things and put it back down. I've never read any of the reboot. I decided the other day to change that.

Goal 1: to read all of the original series.

Goal 2: to read all of the chapters that are out so far for the reboot.

I intend to do things in order, but excitement has gotten the better of me ^^; and so I admittedly have already read the prologue chapter and the first chapter of the reboot. I gotta say, this is interesting stuff. More than one "Oh my God! " or "Holy shit! " escaped from my lips while reading this. While I'm not ordinarily a fan of alternate universes or alternate timelines, I'm certainly willing to overlook it in this case since Peach Pit felt (for reasons I still don't know myself, having never finished the manga nor read spoilers) that they couldn't tell the story they wanted to tell given the limitations of the very universe they'd written in the original story. And besides, the idea of alternate universes or timelines is certainly something that could arguably be said to have tied in to Rozen Maiden from the very beginning, what with the nature of the N-fields and LaPlace's Demon and all. Still, I gotta say that it's very fascinating how in the reboot ...

Spoiler: show
Jun is actually the one who made Shinku. Mind you, I'm disappointed that he wa spoonfed many of the parts by a mysterious sender, but still: the fact is, he assembled her himself. It'll be interesting to see, then, if the other humans assembled the other Rozen Maidens or if they just found theirs already assembled like they did in the original series.

The chapter ends on a ridiculously exciting cliffhanger. Makes me that much more eager to finish the original manga and to then catch up with the reboot.

If you're looking for something to watch, here's a friendly nudge to check out Rozen Maiden. It may not be a perfect series , but it's one of my all-time favorites, one that's very near and dear to my heart as a result.

P.S.
Spoiler: show
I was wondering if they'd address the fact that Jun's name in this timeline appears to be 島田 Shimada rather than 桜だ Sakurada like it originally was. And sure enough ... they point it out in the final page of the first chapter. Whether the new timeline's Jun is also Sakurada Jun and he legally changed his name for some reason or whether the new Jun has always been known as Shimada Jun, I guess I'll have to wait to see. Regardless, given the flashbacks we saw of Shimada Jun's past and the backstory we learned about Shimada Jun, it's clear that he and Sakurada Jun are the exact same person.

P.P.S. CAN'T WAIT TO MEET REBOOT SUIGIN TOU.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2012, 02:18 PM   #9
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578

She's baaaaaack. And just as awesome as ever.

So, I've re-read Volumes 1 thru 3 and am now embarking into novel territory for me with Volume 4. I thought I'd offer a few thoughts and a ton of artwork before I press on.

The manga is quite similar to and yet at the same time quite different from the anime. This is because of several factors. One, the anime and manga have different canons and do some things completely differently. Two, the anime and the manga sometimes have the exact same events (cel-for-cel) but they don't present them in nearly the same places. Like, the anime may depict it in Episode 12 (series finale) but the manga presents it way earlier in like early Volume 2. Then, vice versa, the manga doesn't do something until mid-Volume 3 but in the anime it's like Episode 5. Three, there are also quite a few things that both not only do identically but even present in the same order. Obviously, I knew all this already from back when I first got into Rozen Maiden in 2005, but I feel it's worth bringing up just because of how frequently I noticed it. It's very, very fair to say that the anime is more like "inspired by the manga Rozen Maiden" than it is to say that it's "a television adaptation of the manga Rozen Maiden."

Everyone's favorite villain Suigin Tou is back and oh is she glorious. I've uploaded a lot of samples for you to check out. Major major spoilers have been edited out by me, but I'd still advise you to only click if you're not super-duper mega-spoiler averse.

Suigin Tou pics:

Spoiler: show

In the third picture (it's a very slender column and easy to miss in this post, so be sure to spot it between Pics 2 and 4!), I really like how Peach Pit was able to convey the creepiness and doll-ness of these dolls. With just a few curvy lines and Suigin Tou's head already rotated 90 degrees, they give you this perfect mental image of her head quickly swiveling around to lay her eyes on Jun. It's creepy, it's awesome, it's Suigin Tou at her best. (You can see the very next page, actually, in Sample Image 4.) In the sixth sample image, you can see an example of Suigin Tou looking deranged. The anime did a good job of this, too, but they didn't do it nearly as often as the manga seems to. When she looks like this, it's pretty blood-curdling. Still, my favorite Suigin Tou is when she's either looking badass-sexy or just beautiful in general. For the latter, look to the very next picture (Sample #7). For the former, look at Samples #9, 10, and 11. Ten and Eleven were so awesome, in fact, that the animators took these exact cels and transplanted them into a different scene in the anime. While the context was changed, the badassery was not. Damn, she's one awesome villain.

There are some other things Peach Pit drew pretty well that I thought I'd share. For the most part, I find Peach Pit's artwork to be very lacking. Very lacking. ^^; But there are some things they drew that are pretty nice. Expand this second spoiler box to see those:

Other Nice Pictures:

Spoiler: show


These are two pictures of Shinku explaining stuff about the maidens or the Alice Game. I thought the art in them, as well as the importance of what she's saying, made these pages pretty memorable.



This picture's a great example of just how much like a real, living child Hina Ichigo is.



These are some pictures of Jun & Co. riding atop Suiseiseki's leaf. I don't remember such a thing in the anime, but I wish they'd added it to Season 2. I think that first one's especially pretty.

This one's from the very end of Volume 3 and is one of the very final scenes in the final episode of Season 1. So I'm not going to thumbnail hotlink it for that very reason. Click on it if you've seen through Season 1. Please don't if you have not.



Here are Shinku and Hina Ichigo watching Detective KunKun. It's great to see such a cute running gag in such a charming series as this. It lends the dolls a little added depth. And it's definitely funny, as Jun remarks on the next page, that you've got enchanted dolls whose favorite television program is a puppet theater show.



Here are four of the sisters. Well-drawn.



And to finish it off, here are three pictures of the beautiful Suiseiseki.

So anyway, now I press on into Volume 4.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 01:06 AM   #10
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
A few months ago, I made it all the way towards the end of Volume 5 before putting the series back down, not because I was bored (quite the contrary! ) but because I wanted to make this post first. Well, I never did. ^^; And even tonight, I'm feeling a bit lazy regarding it. So ... I'm just going to focus in on the bits I want to most. But I guess first, some general recap stuff (to facilitate comparisons with the anime).

Volume 4 more or less polishes off the last of the Season 1 material. We'd already been tapping into Season 2 material in the previous volumes, but Volume 4 gives us closure for all the stuff we saw in the first season of the anime.

Spoiler: show
In Volume 3, we'd had the big epic one-against-all fight between Suigin Tou and Shinku, Suisei Seki, and Hina Ichigo. (IIRC Sousei Seki was fighting alongside Suigin Tou but they weren't allies by any means.) In the anime, this fight is combined with some events from Volume 4 to give us the final stretch of Season 1. Whereas the anime has Shinku lose her arm only for Jun to reattach it rather quickly, for Shinku to then beat Suigin Tou up, etc, Volume 4 of the manga is basically the Shinku's Arm Retrieval arc. Jun manages to get the arm back at the very end of Volume 3 but it's Volume 4 where he spends most of his time trying to figure out how to get it out of the thorny cage inside which it currently is. After Jun reattaches Shinku's arm (towards the end of Volume 4), then Shinku punches Suigin Tou and Suigin Tou retreats. They're two different encounters in the manga that were merged into one in the anime.

The bulk of Volume 4 focuses on Suisei Seki entreating Jun to help her retrieve Sousei Seki from the old man Sousei Seki calls her master. They end up paying a visit to his mansion and walk right into a trap. At the end of this visit, they learn the truth about the old man, they learn why he wants Sousei Seki (he wants to get revenge on the woman he blames for his own beloved twin's death), and Sousei Seki ends up sacrificing herself to rescue him from the darkness as well as our heroes who are inside his dream world too. This is quite different from Season 2 in the anime where Sousei Seki falls to Suigin Tou in combat.

Sousei Seki's death
Suigin Tou takes the Rosa Mystica

I like both versions of the events but I think I prefer the manga version more. In the anime, Suigin Tou actually goes through with it and murders one of her own sisters in order to become Alice. While this shows her immeasurable determination to become Father's one true daughter, it really casts Suigin Tou in a strong villain light. (Which is both good and bad, hence why I don't know which one I like more! ^^; ) In the manga version, by contrast, she talks up a good talk about killing Shinku and the others ... but she never actually does it. It leaves open the possibility that she doesn't have it in her to kill them. *shrug* In any event, she swallows Sousei Seki's Rosa Mystica and ...

"The power ...
"THE POWEEEER!"

Ohhhhhh yeah, baby. Season 2's Suigin Tou version 2.0.1 with Sousei Seki upgrade. It's at this point in the manga that Jun then fixes Shinku's arm and ...

(he fixes her arm, and then ...)
KAPOW!

Suigin Tou, with death in her eyes, offers Shinku some parting words before taking her leave.

And so ends Volume 4 ... well, not quite. ^_^; We get one final bonus chapter. And it happens to be none other than one of my all-time favorite episodes from the anime, S2E5, the episode where Hina Ichigo braves the outside world in order to mail a letter to Jun. At the end of this chapter, we actually see Kanaria for the very first time. We also see Megu once again, singing that song of hers, Suigin Tou listening to it from out of eyesight of the hospital staff.

Volume 5 then comes along and it is grand. If you're a Rozen Maiden fan, this is the volume. The first chapter of the book is, without a doubt, my favorite Rozen Maiden manga chapter to date. So you can probably guess which chapter it is ...

Spoiler: show
Of course: it's the Suigin Tou + Megu backstory chapter.

It's presented in the form of a flashback. Suigin Tou is inside the nearby church, in pain and delirious from what seems to be rejection by her body of Sousei Seki's Rosa Mystica. Her mind comes back to the present every now and again but for the most part it flashes back to the past and allows us to see how she and Megu met.

crude scans of the chapter from the Internet: a | b | c | d | e | f | g

Given that this chapter was penned after Season 1 started airing, I'm not surprised to see Peach Pit make canon what appears to be something of a retcon for them: Suigin Tou's lack of need for a medium. In the anime, this was something of a major point for Suigin Tou: she was the badass doll who didn't need a medium to fight while the other sisters did. But in the manga, from a relatively early point (Volume 2? Volume 3?), we learn of the existence of Megu and it's pretty obvious that she's the person Suigin Tou formed a contract with. This created a discrepancy between the manga and the anime then ... or at least, it did until Volume 5 came along. In this chapter, Suigin Tou, just barely not breaking the fourth wall , explains to Megu that she doesn't need a human medium to function ... but she wants Megu to provide her with energy anyway since it'll give her a leg up in the competition. (This fits in nicely with the anime's version of the events since, in the anime, Suigin Tou goes it alone in Season 1 and does an admirable job but ultimately loses to the Shinku + Jun team when fighting in the enemy's (their) home territory. She then comes back in Season 2 and realizes that if she wants to beat Shinku and the others that she'll have to power up.)

I loved seeing Megu's conversation from the anime, the one with the nurse where she explains why she wants to die, show up in the manga too. It was possibly even better in the manga. They make it very clear that this girl is calm, rational, level-headed ... but at the same time, she's kind of a child still and she has a very romantic view of death. I love how, after being so romantic with her death lecture, she then curtly tells the nurse "So I'm sorry but I won't eat any of that crappy hospital food." ^^;

Megu's meeting with Suigin Tou is, again, wonderful and just like in the anime. "An angel? :o " she asks. Suigin Tou's all sassy and cold with "Who ever heard of an angel dressed in black? " and then proceeds to explain to Megu what Megu represents to her: food. And then ... she's completely caught off guard by Megu's ecstatic response. "This is my lucky day! ^.^" I just love Suigin Tou's look in the panel right below that. Confused. Disturbed. Startled.

The manga does a wonderful job of supporting the theory I've had ever since meeting Megu all those years ago in Season 2 of the anime, and that is ... that Suigin Tou plans to win the Alice Game for Megu. That's the impression I have of the story, of where Peach Pit planned on taking this. I've no idea of how things will ultimately end -- I hear it's quite bad so I'm not looking forward to it ^^; -- but this chapter, like the corresponding anime episode, definitely seems to set things up for Suigin Tou winning the Alice Game but then giving all of the Rosa Mystica to Megu. This has the effect of curing Megu of her terminal illness and thus making Megu "Alice."

The manga also does a wonderful job of showing just how appropriate a pairing Suigin Tou and Megu are. Megu and Suigin Tou are so very alike and yet so very different and each of these in very important ways. The two are similar in that they're both "junk," they're both "broken girls." Megu has a terminal illness that keeps her bedridden while Suigin Tou has no torso. But they're different in that Suigin Tou wants very much to live and become a human girl, even if that means killing others (human and Rozen Maiden alike), whereas Megu, who is a human girl, wants very much to die and is even willing to give herself up to Suigin Tou and be consumed as fuel if it means that in death her life might have had some meaning. I guess to put it more succinctly, Megu is human but wishes she wasn't (i.e. wishes she were dead) while Suigin Tou is not human but wishes she were.

I love how, as Suigin Tou comes out of her flashback towards the end of the chapter, she's recalling just how similar Megu is to her -- and I love, even more, how the scene seems to be hinting at the idea of Suigin Tou switching her goal from fighting so that she herself can become Alice to fighting so that Megu's disease can be cured and she (Megu) can "become Alice." Anyway, enough gushing from me about the best chapter in the whole damn series ...

After this chapter, we have the classic Season 2 comedy episode where Suisei Seki and Hina Ichigo do various things around the house, many of them well-intentioned, that end up causing a lot of property damage. It's great to see how so many of the awesome visuals from the anime were originally envisioned by Peach Pit themselves and were part of the manga.

Later on in Volume 5, we finally learn the truth about why Jun became a hikikomori. It's quite different from the anime version and it would have surprised me more had I not known about it since like 2005 or so. ^_^; I think the anime's version is more beneficial for people in real life, that is to say I think that Anime Jun is a more relatable character for more people IRL than Manga Jun is, but I think Manga Jun's reason for becoming a hikikomori is more convincing and it also better fits his role in this story.

Finally, one of the last things I saw in the manga before putting it down was ...

Spoiler: show
... meeting Micchan, Kanaria's master. I love the argument Hina and Kanaria get into in a later scene where they bicker over whose master is better. "JUN! MICCHAN! JUN! MICCHAN! JUN, JUN, JUN! MICCHAN, MICCHAN, MICCHAN! "

Yeah, sorry readers and sorry future self that this post isn't quite as good as the previous one. ^_^; But I'm eager to start reading the books again and so--

*sees the time*

2 o'clock!? D: Oh man. >_< I guess it's time for bed then. =\

Last edited by Talon87; 04-30-2012 at 01:16 AM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 04:19 AM   #11
Doppleganger
我が名は勇者王!
 
Doppleganger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Emina Isle
Posts: 14,199
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
Manga came first, right? From how your were talking in the third post above this, you left an impression that the manga depended on the anime, rather than the other way around.
__________________
あなたの勇気が切り開く未来
ふたりの想いが見つけだす希望
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
永遠を抱きしめて
Doppleganger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2012, 10:03 AM   #12
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
The manga came first but:

1) My experience was anime before manga; and
2) Only the first four volumes' worth of material came out before the first season of the anime. Then some more material came out between Season 1 and Season 2. Then Season 2 ended. And then, some time later, so did the manga.

So like I mentioned in last night's post, the manga was able to start borrowing ideas from the anime starting around Volume 5 -- and the first clear example is ...

Spoiler: show
... their explanation of how Suigin Tou operates. The manga makes it seem like she operates no differently than her sisters, relying upon a medium for magical sustenance. Then the anime said, "Actually, she's got quite the special ability. She doesn't need a medium. Unlike her sisters, Suigin Tou is perfectly capable of fighting without one." Then the manga says, "Oh yeah! She does have this special ability. But, uh, she's not using it because doing things the traditional way will be better for her." And then the anime takes advantage of this manga-born proposition when explaining in Season 2 why she'd now seek out a medium when in Season 1 it had been something of a pride point that she didn't require one. "If I'm going to beat Shinku and her master, then I'm going to have to be able to do that anywhere -- even if it means fighting in their dream worlds. And that means I'm going to need power. Extra power."

It's a case of the adaptation influencing the original which then influences the adaptation and results in the two converging. Of course, the two remain divergent (and continue to diverge) on a number of important plot points, so in the end I'd still say what I said a few months back: the Rozen Maiden anime is more of a "based on / inspired by the manga" than it is a strict visual adaptation of the manga from print to television.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2012, 11:17 PM   #13
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
So, after days of dilly-dallying and stalling, I finished Book 5 off the other day (I had only had one chapter of original content remaining) and started on Book 6, barely scratching the surface before putting it down for the day. Then today, I pushed myself to pick it back up -- what it is with me and being so lethargic when it comes to reading, I just don't know! ^^; -- and I absolutely loved it. I ripped through all of Book 6 (minus the first little bit, half or so of the first chapter) and all of Book 7 just now. A lot of the surprises I already knew about from years and years ago, but a lot of the finer details were news to me and there were even some original surprises still left in store.

I've only got the final, super-thin Volume 8 left to read; and with the way things were developing towards the end of Volume 7, I can already begin to anticipate the possible causes for the fans' disappointment with how the series came to an end. I think that if I were among their number back in 2006, 2007 and I were reading the manga as it came out in Japan that I too would be pissed that it was already ending, just when things were starting to get interesting and when we had so many unanswered questions still, but since I've known the ending to this manga was controversial and poorly-received ever since '07, and since I've been so very starved for new Rozen Maiden content all these years, and since I am such a huge dork-fan of the series, I've positively loved every single cel of these last two volumes.

The scene at the bottom of the Sea of Consciousness (Phase 34):
Spoiler: show

Right from the get-go, I knew this was going to be good. I've long speculated, as have a number of fans, that Jun may in fact be the doll master Rozen, that Rozen Maiden may take place during Rozen's childhood, that the dolls he created in Earth's 19th century (or earlier) were in fact created by him in his later life after he time traveled back to that era, for what reason who can say. It seems a bit crazy admittedly but in a series like Rozen Maiden where animated dolls wage mortal combat in order to become a human girl, anything's possible. What's more, the manga makes frequent references to concepts from physics like LaPlace's demon and alternate dimensions, so the idea of trans-temporal travel doesn't seem so farfetched when you think about it. Anyway, even if Jun isn't Rozen, both the anime and the manga make it pretty clear that Jun belongs to an elite cadre of individuals, of which Rozen is one, who are able to breathe life into dolls. Shinku refers to them as "maestros" and both she and Suigin Tou are left to wonder if Jun might not be a maestro after he successfully reconnects Shinku's arm.

So when Jun falls into a deep depression and runs into Suigin Tou, who is also drowning in a deep depression of her own, at the bottom of the Sea of Consciousness, it is no surprise (though quite a welcome development! ) when the doll mistakes Jun for her own beloved Father. *YESSSSS* Cue an incredible Jun x Suigin Tou bonding moment that lasts for the bulk of the chapter, interrupted once Suigin Tou finally recognizes that Jun is in fact not Father but someone else.

What I liked about this scene was how Jun really reached out to Suigin Tou. How, even after she realized he wasn't Father and started trying to wrest herself free of his grip, he wouldn't let go. How he tried to hang on tight to her even once the waves came crashing down on them. How, as they were pulled apart, she softly wondered aloud, "Who ... are you?" Even if I'm a huge fan of Suigin Tou + Megu, I like the idea of Suigin Tou formally meeting Jun and getting along with him. Probably won't happen before the original series wraps up, but who can say for the reboot?

The best team ever continues being awesome:
Spoiler: show
Of course I'm talking about my two favorite characters in this entire franchise, Suigin Tou and Megu.


In both volumes, we get a ton of Suigin Tou screentime. And in both volumes, we get at least one solid chapter's worth of material, perhaps even a bit more than that, of scenes with Megu in the hospital. It's good stuff. The girls (Peach Pit) definitely know what their audience wants and know how to please.

In Volume 6, Megu finds Suigin Tou on the hospital grounds, her church home having been destroyed in the previous volume and she unable to seek refuge inside her Rozen Maiden box due to her enormous wings being unable to be folded back down to normal size due to what appears to be a rejection of Suigin Tou's body by Sousei Seki's Rosa Mystica. One of my favorite scenes in the entire manga was what happened next: Megu brings Suigin Tou back upstairs with her, hiding her under her bed (link), trying to nurse her back to health but having her taste the yucky hospital food she so hates herself (link), drawing her beloved angel into bed with her (link), and then, after giggling with her, turning gravely serious and imploring once again to please form a formal contract with her and to use her life up in order to heal Suigin Tou's damaged wings (link). Suigin Tou mulls this over in what has to be the second or third such scene, but this is one of the most clear demonstrations of the truth that is obvious to perhaps everyone but Tou herself: she loves Megu too much to consume her life force. (link)

We get another scene with Megu and Suigin Tou in the hospital and this time we see the dark side of Megu as she angrily lashes out at a nurse who is just trying to be nice. It reminds me of the scene in Katawa Shoujo with Hanako's Bad End. Seeing someone you love who is so beautiful and sweet and pure suddenly turn ugly and mean is one of the worst things you can see. >.< Before Suigin Tou even has time to process what she's just overheard, she hears Megu mutter "Dad ..." ... and then the scene ends until next chapter. ^_^;

So we press on to Volume 7, the last of the big books of the original series, and man oh man is this one killer. Our first dose of Suigin Tou this volume is the continuation of the last scene: in walks Megu's father (link) and Suigin Tou listens from her hiding spot on the ledge outside Megu's window while Megu and her father talk for the first time in months. She angrily lashes out at him, throwing books and anything she can get her hands on at him, and tells him she hopes he drops dead. (Oh jeez. Link.) She bursts into tears as he leaves the room and goes to sleep. Suigin Tou remembers what Megu told her long ago, considers what she just witnessed, and unable to bear seeing Megu like this, resolves to grant the girl her wish. And as she pulls out her ring to place on Megu's finger ... (link)

"SURPRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIISE! "

In comes the seventh Rozen Maiden, Kirakishou. (link)

Suigin Tou plays her usual tough badass self but Kirakishou seems to see right through it and reveals to the readers something about Suigin Tou we'd never even known before (and I'm not even sure how to take it! ^^; ) -- that despite loving Father more than any of the other Rozen Maidens, Suigin Tou apparently wants to kill Father. (link) (Huhwhaaaaaaaaaat? This is so incompatible with my view of Suigin Tou that I'm going to pretend Kirakishou doesn't know what the hell she's talking about. ^^; ) The scene cuts out here, transitioning back to the Canaria / Shinku / Hina Ichigo scene, but when we come back, it's on this page here (link) and Suigin Tou is once again putting on her villainous femme fatale airs, trying to bluff her way around Kirakishou's piercing gaze. But it doesn't work: Kirakishou need only point out Megu's continued existence and Suigin Tou's damaged wing to prove to them both that Suigin Tou is lying about not caring about Megu's life. An epic stare down ensues ... (link)


... and then Kirakishou drops a bomb. A huge one. I had heard from the fandom, I had seen in the fanart, that Kirakishou had a peculiar admiration for her big sister, but holy cow I did not expect this. Kirakishou pulls out her own Rosa Mystica and offers it to Suigin Tou. (link) But like any deal that seems too good to be true, Kirakishou's offer comes with a price, and a terrible one at that. "I will give my Rosa Mystica to you and all our sisters. In return, I would like to have ... your master." (link) After Kirakishou leaves, Suigin Tou mulls the offer over. And then ...

"Megu ... give me your left hand."

You've never seen a girl get so happy in your entire life. ^^; Suigin Tou, on the other hand, doesn't seem happy at all. (link) You can tell that she feels like she's been forced to do this. Perhaps that was Kirakishou's intent from the very beginning. To scare Suigin Tou into formally making a contract with Megu by threatening to take her away from Suigin Tou in exchange for Kirakishou's very own life force. Or perhaps Suigin Tou is making this contract with Megu specifically so that she can hand her over to Kirakishou, in exchange for the free Rosa Mystica, but she feels incredibly shitty about doing this since she's come to love Megu so much ... and she hates herself for being so soft when the Suigin Tou of Volume 1 used to be such an ice queen. But in the end, Suigin Tou places her ring on Megu's finger in what looks like a wedding ceremony. And as the two exchange vows, this promising exchange takes place: (link)

Megu: 'Til death do us part ...?
Suigin Tou: No. We're together in death too ...
Suigin Tou (internal): Megu ... you are ... my dear ...


She doesn't finish the thought, and I'm not even sure if that second line belongs to Suigin Tou or Megu (decide for yourself), but it's pretty clear from the last bit that Suigin Tou still really does care deeply about Megu and, whether she intends to end Megu's life and is feeling really shitty about it or whether she intends to fight for Megu's life and formed this contract to safeguard Megu against Kirakishou, I don't know -- but regardless, Suigin Tou clearly considers Megu her one dear friend.

Oh wow, I've already written so much. @_@ ^^; I should try and wrap the other huge points up quickly then. And then I'll finish off discussing the art.

The Seventh Doll:
Spoiler: show

I've known about Kirakishou since the second season of the anime wrapped up and I went on an information gathering spree online. So I know all about how she didn't originally have a body and lived inside the N-field, about how she killed Hina Ichigo, about how she had an onee-sama complex with Suigin Tou, and so on. But there were some things I either didn't know (like HOLY SHIT YOU'RE GOING TO GIVE HER YOUR LIFEFORCE!? ) or had forgotten about (like how she actually takes Hina Ichigo's body for her own so that she can have physical form in the real world).

What I loved most about meeting Kirakishou after all these years was seeing the similarities between her (in the original source material) and her anime impostor, Bara Suishou. Like the part when Shinku first runs into her in the N-field and asks "Who are you?" and she fires back with "Who are you?" Or like the fact that they both do crystal magic. Bara Suishou also seemed to have an onee-sama complex with Suigin Tou, albeit a much milder one. And both characters had mysterious masters. In Bara Suishou's case, it was Enju. In Kirakishou's case, it was Odile Fosset, the granddaughter of Hina Ichigo's former master, Corinne Fosset. All these similarities and differences were quite fun to pick out while I was reading.


Even though I first saw it years ago, back in 2006 or 2007 and in Japanese, it was still chilling and intense to see Kirakishou kill Hina Ichigo. It's like watching a python devour a rat. The rat is so small and helpless and you can't help but to feel bad for it as the python effortlessly coils around it and mercilessly devours it.

So what's happening with Jun?:
Spoiler: show
Jun's story was marginally developed in Volume 6 -- I don't even remember what all happened other than him crawling out of bed eventually, following his run-in with Suigin Tou in the Sea of Unconsciousness-- but it really took off like a bottle rocket towards the end of Volume 7. In a fantastic turn of events, Kanaria invites herself back over to the Sakuradas ... and brings Micchan along with her. (link) It was great seeing Micchan finally meet the other Rozen Maidens. (link) And I loved seeing Kanaria show off Micchan to the others as well. (link) When Jun criticizes the design flaws of Micchan's dress for the upcoming competition she's entered, he unwittingly opens Pandora's Box. Micchan is convinced Jun is a prodigy -- this ought to earn her some wisdom points in Shinku's book, maybe ^^; -- and she implores him to fix up her design and turn it into something real. When he does, she takes a photo of it, puts it up for an auction, and sets the initial price at $50. Jun gets emo and smug -- "I knew nobody would want it" -- when he sees that nobody has placed a bid with only a couple of hours to go before the auction's up. However, he gets a phone call from Micchan telling him to look at the auction page. Just like with eBay in real life, the auction doesn't really pick up any steam until you get close to time running out. That's when the bids start pouring in. $100. $200. $500. $1000. The dress ends up selling for over $1000. Micchan courteously gives Jun the check, saying it was his redesign and his actual physical labor which won the auction, not her original imperfect concept. She asks him to keep working with her and ...

... well, he turns her down. But! Having finally regained confidence in himself, he cracks open his textbooks ... and starts studying for the first time in months. Where this'll go, who can say. It feels like slightly rushed development? And kinda open-ended development at that? So yeah, I'd probably be sorta pissed if I had read this back in '07 and had been caught unawares that Rozen Maiden was wrapping up? But knowing it in advance, I don't feel like it's too too rushed.

Canaria:
Spoiler: show

Canaria was more interesting in Volumes 6 and 7 than she was in Volume 5. It was much more obvious in the manga than it was in the anime that she was something of a playmate for Hina Ichigo and that she took Hina's death harder than (or at least as hard as) the other sisters did. I really hate her official colors -- green hair, green eyes, and yellow dress make for a TERRIBLE combination >_< -- but in the black-and-white manga where you're not being bombarded by them constantly she's not so bad to watch. It was cool to see her open her can of whoopass on Shinku when she suspected that Shinku had been playing them all for fools all along:


Not much else to say though because I've been sat here writing this post for the past half an hour and I'd really like to wrap it up. @_@

Remaining pictures & commentary on artwork:

Be sure to check out all the artwork in the spoiler boxes above as well, but here's a dump for the other pictures. Comments'll follow below.

Spoiler: show


I've really been impressed with Peach Pit's improvements in drawing over the past two volumes. When I started reading this manga, I didn't feel like they drew very well at all. Stylistically, they haven't changed all that much; but technically, I think they've shown modest improvement between Volume 1 and Volume 8. I don't want to accuse them of being lazy -- drawing's hard work, especially when you're on a tight schedule! -- but in the earlier volumes it was pretty uncommon for us to get pretty drawings of the characters except for the occasional full page or two-page spread. Now in the most recent volumes, we get drawings that'd previously have been reserved for those full-page spreads instead showing up in ordinary cels alongside speech bubbles. (You can see some of them in the spoiler boxes above.)

As you can see in the Shinku vs. Canaria fight, Peach Pit really improved in learning how to draw a fight and make it seem exciting. That fight was incredibly short-lived thanks to Hina Ichigo's interruption but even with the small amount we did get it was still exciting.

I really loved the art here. Just gorgeous. Almost all of the Kirakishou + Suigin Tou pages are.

I like how in several of the cels in these volumes (including this one posted above) we get to see how the maidens scale up to an actual human. They're pretty big! ^_^ We can argue whether they're above or below 3 feet in height (I would say they're below it) but they're definitely not the roughly 18-inch dolls that I'd say the anime depicts them as. They're at least two feet tall and probably taller.

Could keep writing more but it's been like 45 minutes now since I started writing this post. @_@ Time for me to take a well-earned break ...and polish off this wonderful manga! I'll offer final thoughts on the original series once I do.

Last edited by Talon87; 05-17-2012 at 02:53 PM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2012, 02:37 PM   #14
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Read Chapters 41 and 42 Thursday evening but was interrupted by friends; and just finished Chapter 43, the final chapter of the original Rozen Maiden, just now. "WOOOOOOOOW ... " is what I said as I finished it. What kind of "wow" was it? Well, open the spoiler box to find out. But be warned! I'm pretty much spoiling the end of the original series for you. You should not click if you haven't seen the animes yet, intend to read the manga some day, etc.

Spoiler: show
Talk about your ridiculous cliffhanger endings! Now I see why fans were so pissed. I don't have to be pissed because I'm coming at this as a guy in 2012, from a world where we have over thirty-six chapters from the second series, but I'm betting that when people read this chapter originally they were livid. Because it is such a cliffhanger. And because they had been told by the magazine and by Peach Pit, "We're bringing Rozen Maiden to a close."

At the start of Volume 8, Jun decides to get his life back on track and asks Tomoe to help him study at the library. It hearkens back to a scene we saw in Season 1 or 2 where he went with her to the library to look some stuff up on the dolls. In any event, he surprisingly becomes even more withdrawn, in a sense, snapping at Nori for treating him like he has a psychiatric problem and even going so far as to pick up the dolls' boxes and dumping them outside in the hallway. It's like he's pretty much shutting the dolls out of his life now that he's decided to get his life back in order. In Chapter 42, I think it was, this comes to a head when he snaps at Nori, making her crestfallen and wondering to herself, paraquote, "This is what I had wished for, but it's not at all what I wanted."

The real excitement takes place with the dolls. Shinku decides to keep Hina Ichigo's demise a secret from Suisei Seki. (I had thought Suisei Seki knew but I guess not. ) Likewise, Suisei Seki decides to keep the surprise disappearance of Sousei Seki's body a secret from Shinku. The two sisters each go into the N Field trying to find clues with respect to their respective mysteries when they happen to bump into one another and spill the beans. Agreeing to no longer keep any secrets between them, Suisei Seki learns from Shinku that Odile is trapped inside the N Field inside a crystal; and Shinku learns from Suisei Seki that the same fate has befallen the old man, Sousei Seki's former master. Each of them has a ring on their fingers but this shouldn't be the case, the sisters realize, if Odile is really Hina Ichigo's master (since Hina's body was devoured) or if the old man is Sousei Seki's (since her body's vanished and she died ages ago anyway). So the sisters conclude that Kirakishou is likely Odile's master (they don't connect her to the old man but I think it's pretty obvious to the reader that this is the case). This is when LaPlace's Demon shows up and, Q-like, congratulates the girls for their detective work and then informs them that Kirakishou doesn't need humans' life force to survive but rather their very souls. Like usual, his explanations are confusing, but Shinku seems to inexplicably reach the conclusion that Kirakishou can only steal a human's soul if they have formed a contract with one of the seven dolls. This'll be important later.

Anyway, the two sisters, Shinku and Suisei Seki, realize that Jun's life is danger. Shinku goes back to him one way, Suisei Seki goes back to him another way. Both sisters end up being intercepted by Kirakishou though. Shinku gets ensnared in a spider's web made from thorny rose vines where the real Kirakishou lies in wait while Suisei Seki is intercepted by none other than Sousei Seki ... or so she thinks. It looks like Kirakishou, somehow, managed to get Sousei Seki's body and Rosa Mystica -- why would Suigin Tou willingly loan her the latter? -- but she still has control over Sousei Seki's mind or something. In any event, we see all this come to a head in Chapter 43.

It's in the final chapter of the book that Shinku concludes to herself that the only way she can protect Jun, now that it's come to this, is to break their contract. Far away, Suisei Seki likewise breaks her contract with Jun but for completely different reasons. She realizes that this Sousei Seki is an impostor (because she's not acting like the real Sousei Seki would) but she seems not to care, perhaps because she realizes it is her sister's genuine body in front of her? , and she withdraws from the Alice Game to intentionally fall into the trap alongside Sousei Seki and spend eternity with her in limbo. (Uhhhh ............ ^^; , cue Reason #1 the fans were probably pissed? ^^; ) With both of his two servants having broken their contracts with him, Jun's rose ring disappears from his finger. He doesn't find this out until he's woken up by a sobbing Nori who, with Canaria close behind, has just learned from Berrybell (Hina Ichigo's spirit servant) the truth behind Hina's disappearance. Jun sees the visions too and becomes horrified. Together, he and Nori travel into the N Field along with Canaria to try and rescue the sisters. There, he runs into LaPlace's Demon. The rabbit shows Jun the state of each of the sisters -- Shinku caught in the rose spider web, Suisei Seki ensnared by vines that sprung out of Impostor Sousei Seki's eyeball, and even Suigin Tou entangled in vines that came out of Megu's hospital room mirror -- and, in his usual manner, explains to Jun in riddle-like speech that if Jun wants to save the dolls, he's going to have to take a big risk and open a door. Jun opens the door ...

... and the manga ends. ^^;

Obviously, this was perfectly setting things up for the reboot ... which, if I had to say based on what I just read, is probably not an actual reboot. It seems much more likely to me that the second Rozen Maiden is more like Part 2 in our story, and that Part 1 was the first forty-three chapters we just read. Perhaps it is a reboot insofar as it may allow them to try and establish some canon relationships differently (like, with human-doll pairings, how long other humans beside Jun stay in the war, and so on), but it seems pretty clear to me at this point that when Jun opened the door, he either (a) became his alternate universe self or else (b) opened up that alternate universe and will have to travel into it to try and fix things back in his own home universe, one of the two. It remains to be seen whether there are two of each of the dolls (e.g. two Shinkus, one in each universe) or whether this story is all taking place within one universe and that there is only one of each doll. I guess I'll have my answer once Canaria shows up in the reboot considering she's the only doll who hasn't yet been ensnared by Kirakishou.

EDIT: Oh yeah, I forgot to mention -- Kirakishou pretty much betrays Suigin Tou (although I'm sure she doesn't see it as a betrayal so much as a forced negotiation ^^; ) and takes Megu's body, ensnaring it in those same rose vines coming out of the hospital mirror and dragging it in towards the N Field. It's when Suigin Tou cries out "MEGU! ;_;" and tries to stop her that Kirakishou sicks the vines on her beloved onee-sama as well. So it seems like I was right that Kirakishou tricked Suigin Tou in Volume 7, that she got Suigin Tou to believe "Kirakishou is after Megu so the best way to protect Megu is if I become her servant," not realizing that Kirakishou precisely wanted that very outcome because without it she couldn't lay a finger on Megu. (I guess. Dunno why this is the case but Shinku apparently thinks it is so whatever, let's roll with it.) But yeah. It'll be interesting to see Suigin Tou kick some ass in the second series, whether she's an alternate universe Suigin Tou or whether she's the liberated original.

Excited to move on to the second series? You bet.

Last edited by Talon87; 05-12-2012 at 02:43 PM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2012, 07:16 PM   #15
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
The chapters in the original series were labeled as "phases" while those in the second series are called "tales." I re-read Tales 00 ("How To Make a Girl") and 01 last night as well as reading Tales 02 and 03 for the very first time. I would have read more but I had to get to bed early and have been out all day today. In brief, the two things I have to say are:

1. It was glorious!

-and-

2. It's not right to call this a reboot.

I don't know where or who I heard that from, but from what I've read of the second series so far, this is in no way, shape, or form a reboot of the franchise. It's not even a sequel. What it is is a direct continuation from where we left off at the end of Phase 43. Yes, there is some (only some! two chapters' worth of material at best!) intervening material that happened offscreen "offcel", but for the most part the second Rozen Maiden series (simply named "Rozen Maiden") is the continuation of the first series (also named "Rozen Maiden"). In fact, I would liken it to this:

Rozen Maiden series 1 : Rozen Maiden series 2 :: The Fellowship of the Ring : The Two Towers

Just as Tolkien divided the material for those two books into a first half and a second half, so too, it would seem, did Peach Pit divide their story into two halves: a first half called "Rozen Maiden" and then a second half also called "Rozen Maiden". Just as you would never insist that The Two Towers is a reboot of the LotR franchise, so too am I now raising my eyebrows mega-heavily at those who misled me into thinking that the new Rozen Maiden manga was a reboot of the Rozen Maiden franchise. To explain what I mean more explicitly than this will require spoilers so ... spoiler tag away!

Spoiler: show
In Tale 01, the Jun from the Didn't Wind world gets a text message from the Jun from the Did Wind world, the latter being the protagonist of the original series. He explains that he and Canaria are trying to rescue Shinku and the others and are trying to defeat Kirakishou but that Kirakishou is simply too powerful right now. This perfectly fits with what was seen in the final chapters of the original Rozen Maiden (Phases 41 thru 43).

In Tale 02, the new Jun tries to assemble Shinku quickly. We learn that the Shinku he is assembling is the Shinku of the original Jun's world and that, as far as these two worlds are concerned, there is only one copy of each of the seven sisters, all seven copies originating from the original world. (We're told that in the multiverse there are some dimensions where the sisters exist and others where they do not. It suffices to say that the new Jun's world is one where they did not originally exist and that the ones he's now encountering have migrated over from the original world.) Specifically, we find out that the new Jun is building a temporary body to house Shinku's Rosa Mystica, her original having been destroyed and/or dismantled by Kirakishou. Incidentally, Kirakishou hid Shinku's head and one of her feet in one of the N-field's many portal-worlds. So what ends up happening is that the new Jun builds Shinku a temporary body that consists of:
  • her original head, crafted by Rozen, presumably from wood
  • one of her original feet, crafted by Rozen, presumably from wood
  • all other large body parts (limbs, torso, etc) are polyurethane, received in the mail by the new Jun
  • her dress, sewn by the new Jun
  • all other small body parts (hair, eyes, etc) magically appearing from thin air, with even the new Jun commenting on this
They make it very, very clear that Shinku can't last in this state for very long. That the only reason it was even possible period is thanks to her connection with Jun. And that, like Cinderella's pumpkin carriage, the spell will be broken when the clock strikes midnight after about seven days. This further confirms, as I think you're already seeing, that this story is in no way shaping up to be a reboot of Rozen Maiden but instead looks like a direct continuation.

Either in Tale 02 or Tale 03, the new Jun hears about the fates which befell the other sisters too. It seems clear that the old Jun intends to rescue them all and that he needs new Jun's help to do it.

Kirakishou gate jumps in Tale 02 from the old world into the new one. In Tale 03, she's shown eavesdropping on Shinku. She's also already begun to ensnare the new Jun with her white rose tendrils.

There's no way, imo, you could fully enjoy this without having read the original. Not only is it a direct continuation -- and so it'd be as fucking stupid to read this without reading the original as it would be to read The Two Towers without reading the Fellowship of the Ring first -- but the new series has been constantly making humorous references to the original. For example, Shinku's abusive treatment of Jun; or for another example, her fussiness over tea and her living quarters.

I will probably post again later today or tomorrow with some awesome Suigin Tou artwork. Some of it is weeks old that I've been meaning to share, others less old, and at least one is from a discovery last night. But before I end this post, that does remind me of one final thing to mention: the artwork in the new series is much improved. I'm not sure how much of an IRL hiatus the artist took between drawing Phase 43 and drawing Tale 00, but holy cow did she become better at drawing during the interim period. The manga's still got Peach Pit's characteristically scratchy or sketchbook-looking drawings but they're much improved over the actual scribbles that passed for drawings in many of the earliest chapters' cels. Some of even the most mundane cels here have been really quite pleasant to absorb with the eyes. Will want to share more eventually. For now, try this and this. As you can see with the thumbnail above, Peach Pit's artwork here really doesn't seem to scale well when you shrink it. ^^; I think it's because so much of their artwork is line-based rather than form-based.

Last edited by Talon87; 05-13-2012 at 07:18 PM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2012, 12:37 PM   #16
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578

Through Chapter 05. Chapters 04 and 05 were so, so good. So so good! Man. What treats for fans of the franchise. What absolute treats. Discussion below. Boatloads of in-paragraph hyperlinks so be sure to look for them as you read.

About the dolls:

Spoiler: show
Jun gets another box in the mail at the end of Chapter 03. Shinku warns him at the start of Chapter 04 not to open it and, given who's on the cover of the chapter , I've got a pretty good guess as to who'll be brought to life should he open the box. But it turns out I'm delightfully wrong when Peach Pit has none other than the Did Wind world's Suigin Tou show up via Didn't Wind world Jun's bathroom mirror. Absolutely loved seeing the two sisters be pouty and Jun 2.0 is all, "Huh? ^^; What's going on here?" Loved it when he told Shinku earlier in the chapter that his mental image of Suigin Tou was as this kind, gentle doll. (Basically a nod to Rozen Maiden: Ouverture! ) The two dolls quickly piss each other off to the point of battling in the Didn't Wind world Jun's apartment and, once again, the new Jun shows how he's not quite the same person he was when he was just a 14-year old boy when he roars at them to cut it out and commands them to clean up the mess they've just made. In a strong nod to the original manga, as well as to the fanart community, Peach Pit have Suigin Tou prefer to sit on the balcony or even on the roof of Jun's apartment rather than be cloistered indoors. Suigin Tou is just awesome period. This pouty cel was especially nice.

Anyway, the chapter wraps up with Suigin Tou boasting about being twice as powerful as Shinku thanks to having two Rosae Mysticae ... and then Shinku not being able to resist informing her sister that she too has two Rosae Mysticae ... and then Suigin Tou just losing it over Shinku's apparent hypocrisy. This results in Suigin Tou labeling Shinku a dirty hypocrite and Shinku angrily losing her cool. The chapter ends with the two sisters in a physical catfight. AWEEEEESOOOOOME!

So then we move on to Chapter 05. Suigin Tou just can't leave well enough alone ^^; and follows Shinku into the bathroom where, after a failed attempt to piss her off, she oh ... my ... god ... no you didn't ... yes you did! XD Unbelievable. And then Shinku ... oh my gosh, I can't believe this is happening XD ... and then the two sisters have to wait for their clothes to dry. And while they're there waiting side-by-side, they have a quick little heart to heart. Shinku tells Suigin Tou the truth about why she's here and how she's living on borrowed time. The two sisters discuss the enigmatic Kirakishou and, as they're doing so, Shinku hears for the very first time that Suigin Tou has actually formed a contract with a medium. This surprises her, naturally, and then Peach Pit has Suigin Tou beautifully sum up her relationship with Megu in one succinct speech bubble:


Awwww. I love you girls. GO TEAM SUIGIN TOU!

Upon learning of this, Shinku realizes that there might be hope for what she plans to offer so she presses on. Continuing to lay out the details of her circumstances and telling Suigin Tou they have the same short-term goal, Shinku offers Suigin Tou a truce. And I then had to stop reading so I could pick my jaw up off of the floor. Unfortunately, Suigin Tou will be Suigin Tou ^^; and she promptly rejects Shinku's offer. But the fact that it was even on the table is incredible.

So anyway, just to recap the seven dolls' statuses:
  • Hina Ichigo's still been consumed
  • Sousei Seki's body is still missing
  • Canaria is still in the Did Wind world with the original Jun
  • Kirakishou has snuck into this world ... or perhaps is bouncing between both worlds, it's kind of hard to tell
  • Suigin Tou wound up in this new world while trying to find out where Kirakishou hid Megu
  • the majority of Shinku's real body is still back in the old world while some pieces of it along with a whole bunch of new pieces are forming her surrogate body in the new world
  • Suisei Seki is presumably still ensnared in the old world
Also: in Chapter 05, they reclarify (just in case there was ANY doubt on the part of the readers) that there is only one Shinku, one Suigin Tou, etc, and so for one of the worlds to have one doll, the other world has to lose that same doll. So we definitely can't stay put here for too long. Or at least, so I would think. I'll be surprised if Peach Pit ends up saying "Fuck the original world! " and brings all seven sisters over to the new world. Perhaps that would lend some credence to the whole "reboot" stuff I'd been hearing. But from what I'm seeing so far, this is 1-0-0% a direct continuation of the story. There's no way in hell you could appreciate what's happening without reading the original first. What I'm wondering is if the second series will be the second of three total series adn that there's a third, final series the ladies have planned for 2012/13 and that won't finish (*sigh* ) for at least another three years after that. WHY MUST I WAIT SO LONG FOR MY ROZEN MAIDEN CLOSURE? >.<

About Jun:

Spoiler: show
So what about Jun? Well, as far as the Did Wind world's Jun is concerned, we haven't heard back from him for two whole chapters. As for the Didn't Wind world's Jun, he's been stepping up his relationship with Saitou. And boy is she cute. Cute. Cute. Cute. Saitou is so impressed with Jun's surprising knack for costume design and Jun so enamored with Saitou that he finds himself roped into her theater production group, with Chapter 04 ending with him helping her scary-tough looking older brother with the manual labor. ^^; Chapter 05 opens with Jun here helping her out. Later on in the chapter, we see Jun dealing with that shithead he has to work with at the convenience store, and unfortunately the shithead ends up putting Jun in a really terrible mood by (1) correctly calling that Jun looks down on the shithead and then (2) explaining that if anyone should be looking down on anybody it's the shithead looking down on Jun. In otherwords, the shithead is basically an IRL troll and with just five minutes' worth of trolling he's ruined Jun's entire day. Jun goes home feeling crushed and asks Shinku, for the umpteenth time, if there isn't any way he can help her out. Once again she tells him no, indicating that the only Jun she really cares about is the original Jun, that she can't wait to get out of this world and get back to him, etc. Suigin Tou likewise (not to Jun's face, but still) is all "I'm not sticking around here, I have to get back and rescue Megu." With the prospect of none of the dolls wanting his help and all of them eager to leave his world ASAP, Didn't Wind world Jun is left so angry and depressed that ...

... he decides to open Pandora's box while Shinku is sleeping in her case. He decides to assemble the doll he's been receiving spare parts for after all.

He's pushed over the edge by (presumably) Kirakishou, (presumably) posing as the original Jun and giving the new Jun the green light to go ahead and make dolls of his own. One can only assume that the doll the new Jun is going to make is going to serve as a vessel for Kirakishou to occupy and that, once she manages to fully infiltrate the Didn't Wind world, the dolls will have to move their battlefield over from the original world to this new world.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-2012, 03:41 PM   #17
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Through Tale 11. The reboot that wasn't really a reboot continues to not be a reboot in any logical sense of the word as things get really exciting. Too much has happened to discuss in too specific of details or to share images of, but I'll offer some thoughts:

Spoiler: show
Really loving Suigin Tou's role in all this. Was loving her Minami Kana-esque relationship with the Minami Chiaki-esque Shinku during the play. (Just LOL @ that part where she's laughing at Shinku being tugged on by the actors. )

The plot is getting interesting although I am really confused by some details. For starters, how Kirakishou's body could possibly be Hina Ichigo's and yet at the same time why she wasn't able to just gate-jump the way that Suigin Tou and Suisei Seki have done. I mean, we already saw in the original series that Kirakishou took Hina's physical body for her own, so I don't understand why they'd be saying that without a body of her own she wasn't able to exist in the physical world: 'cause she has one in Hina's! And I don't understand why she'd be able to mail the body parts to Didn't Wind world Jun and then appear in his world if directly gate-jumping while inside Hina's body wouldn't work either. Anyway ... another thing that confuses me is when Shinku claims that Kirakishou has two bodies right now and then says "Hina's and mine". Uhhhh ....... if she devoured your body, then how did the new Jun manage to get your head and foot back? Also, if she devoured your body (which had to occur offscreen since we never actually saw Shinku lose her body in the original series, we just saw her caught in the spider's web and being drawn closer towards a rose-shaped tomb), then why didn't she also devour Sousei Seki's and Suisei Seki's bodies? (In fact, it was hinted at in Volume 8 that she did in fact seize Sousei Seki's body!) Suisei Seki was far more incapacitated than Shinku was. She even had lost her will to live and withdrew from the Alice Game, content to die alongside her sister's corpse. So like, how come we now see Suisei Seki charging in like a cowgirl to save the day? ^^; It's cool and all, don't get me wrong, as a Rozen Maiden fan I'm lovin' Suisei Seki's return, but ... it certainly doesn't make much sense to me. ^^;

It was good to see the original Jun again although it is concerning that he's trapped inside some junk world with Canaria.

Excited to see Suisei Seki but a little concerned that Peach Pit is moving all of the combat over into the new world. As much as I love the plot developments from Tales 01 thru 11, I still feel like the original world is where the "real" story is taking place and that it's going to be nice to get back there pronto and that all of this is something of a side quest. Doesn't mean I don't like alternate universe Jun, 'cause I do, and I wish the guy the best, honest, but ... to me what would be shittier than shafting the new Jun would be to shaft the original Jun.

Am slightly disappointed that the new Jun didn't get to finish his doll for himself. ^^;

Loved it when Shinku remarked at how surprising it was to see Suigin Tou care so deeply for, to fight so hard for, and to so badly want to be reunited with a human as she currently does. Loved how Shinku was like, "I would like to meet the medium who has had such an effect on this girl." Even Shinku's a fan of Team Suigin Tou!

And speaking of Team Suigin Tou, one of the series' most epic moments ever was definitely this page from Tale 10. Suigin Tou is the best doll and Team Suigin Tou is the best team, no question about it. Good lord am I going to be bummed out if Peach Pit has Suigin Tou fail in her mission. You've gotta have Suigin Tou win, you guys. You've just gotta. Even if you don't have her killing the other sisters, fine, whatever, but you've just gotta have her curing Megu's condition even if it's at the cost of her own life. Disappointment and anger await you ladies if you end up killing Megu off.

Absolutely loving this and am excited to see where things go from here.

Last edited by Talon87; 05-14-2012 at 03:45 PM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2012, 01:08 PM   #18
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
;_; ... so ... I'm on Tale 21 right now and ... starting last chapter, the group who had been translating these from English to Japanese quit ... and some Russian /b/tard whose only grasp of English is broken chanspeek picked up where they left off. >.< Let me give you some example speech bubbles ...
"I don't want you to return me Rosa Mystica." ("They're always after me lucky charms!" >.<)

"No, it's all different!" (original Japanese was likely, "You're wrong!")

"In this round of Alice Game you've lost. Winner is me."

"You were lucky with your twin sister's mercy enough."

"Why don't each of you have yours own? That's meaningless for sisters to strive for these!"

"thereby" (meant to say "therefore")

"lately" (meant to say "recently", it was a one-time occurrence)

"These talks about twins, I doubt you really do it | because of something other than your miserable incompleteness."

"because of Rozen Maidens who should not been existent"

"If the clock is made go again"

"WE RELY ON YOU!" ('We're counting on you'!? -_-; Is that so hard!?)

"Cool story bro ... and I'm without boots." (FUCK ... YOU. )

"Wouldn't you look here?" ('Why don't you look here?')

"I could've done something like a rope to go down." (>_<)

"Don't you think you can handle it without me?" (Totally wrong translation, meant to say "Don't think you can handle it without me!")

"Have I been understood?"

"So how should we make this damn clock go?"

"So big? It is nonsense."

"I can ... I can make this clock go." (And this line is the climax of the chapter, too. >_<)

"Gardener twins' power together can do it only."
By the /b/tard's own admission, his English isn't very good. So I'm 100% not making fun of him, I swear. I'm just ... frustrated that this is the only copy of the manga I am able to find. Can't find a better English translation, can't even find a raw. The only thing I can find is this P.O.S. translation. No offense to you, Mr. Russian Dude. ^^; I know you were just trying to help people out. That was very kind of you. But ... your English is so bad that I think I'd just as soon put the manga on hold if this is what it's come to.

I think I'll skip ahead five or so chapters and see if someone new is translating it. Then I'll skip ahead five or ten more and check once again. If it's still the Russian /b/tard, then I guess my Rozen Maiden adventure ends here for now. If the Russian's work was only on Chapters 20 and 21 (oh please please please please please let it be so! ), then I'll finish reading his translation of 21 and move on.

EDIT: It looks like he may have quit some time around Tale 25 or so, it's hard to tell without getting spoilered and I don't want to get spoilered. Anyway, going to try and keep going for now but ... this is getting fucking ridiculous. I'm getting pissed off now. I mean ...
"Well, D I Y?" (I have no clue what he means by this. "Well, do it yourself?" doesn't make any sense in this context. Was he trying to say "Suit yourself?" I have no way of knowing. Don't fuck around with acronyms when you can't even use them correctly. -.-)

"Oh my! Mad skillz you've got thar." (FUUUUUUUCK ... YOOOOOU. )
Ugh. Again: I'm not harassing the guy for his inability to speak in fluent English, I'm just ... this translation is so poor that it's ruining my experience with the story. I'd much sooner read it raw than read it in this faux English.

Last edited by Talon87; 05-15-2012 at 01:35 PM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2012, 03:31 PM   #19
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Through Tale 27. Really intrigued by where the ladies are taking the story, with good news and bad news abounding. Can't even go into it without spoiling people so ... into the spoiler box! But before I do that, first things first: the poor English translations continued into Tale 23. Then in Tale 24, it was still done by the same group but the quality had much improved. Then from Tale 25 forward, it doesn't even show any sign of who it was done by, and the English is just as good as it was originally. So I'm quite pleased once again. Good English translations are back in business!

Spoiler: show
If Phase 43 represented the end of The Fellowship of the Ring and Tale 01 represented the beginning of The Two Towers, then Tale 25 represents the end of The Two Towers and Tale 26 represents the beginning of The Return of the King. In other words, it turns out that our adventure in the alternate universe is over, wrapping up quite cleanly in Tales 24 and 25, and that the alternate universe's Jun's experiences with the Rozen Maidens has more or less come to an end. Besides his memories, he has one souvenir of their visit -- someone's wind-up key, presumably the one that went with Shinku's replica body -- and his life is moving on forward, maidenless. On the flipside, the original Jun made some heavy appearances in Tales 20-25, ended up tag teaming with the new Jun, and ended up being given ownership of Sousei Seki before he and the other maidens decided to head back home to their original world.

One thing that's intriguing is how Peach Pit resurrected Sousei Seki. It opens a can of worms but it's still fun and interesting ... and it, lol, brings Jun that one step closer to "Gotta catch 'em all!" owning every single Rozen Maiden for himself. XD ^^; You can tell that one-quarter on up to one-half of the reason Peach Pit even took us on this twenty-five-chapter diversion in the first place was to justify how Sousei Seki could come back and why Suigin Tou might relinquish Sousei Seki's Rosa Mystica.

Another thing that's intriguing is Kirakishou's apparent defeat. The poor thing just really, really wants a body. ^^; She's presented as being about as psychotic as Bara Suishou was in Season 2 of the anime, meaning she may not be able to ever be trusted or rationed with, but I almost wonder if Jun couldn't bring her into the fold simply by making a body for her and then telling her to be a good girl and not suck his life dry. Obviously that'd be retardedly naive of me, which is why I don't think that that'll actually happen, but still. I feel bad for the girl. Also worthy of note: none of the sisters absorbed Kirakishou's Rosa Mystica, so it remains to be seen whether (1) she's destroyed period (in which case, wow o_o; ), (2) her Rosa Mystica is still trapped in the N-Field nether region between the two Juns' worlds, or (3) her Rosa Mystica made it back safe and sound to an N-field domain that is securely on the original Jun's side of existence.

Although the terrible translations really soured the mood (unfortunately ), it was still a great climactic scene seeing the sisters in the crystal prison, seeing them break out, seeing them fight against Kirakishou one last time, and so on. Something I definitely look forward to re-reading some day in better English ... or better yet, seeing in a thrid season of the anime!?

So now, back to the original Jun's world ...

HOLY FUCKING COW IS THIS CRAZY. XFD It is so nuts how the tone and presentation and storytelling and everything that set the original manga apart from the new manga is back. Thankfully, Peach Pit's improved ability to draw pretty people is still going strong ... however, unlike in the previous twenty-five chapters where beautiful drawings were in nearly every cel and super-deformed chibi drawings were exceedingly rare, now we're back to the original series' formula of having super-deformed chibis and normal drawings in a roughly 1:1 ratio with the really beautiful drawings being reserved for special cels or full-page spreads. I don't know if they did this on purpose to try and subconsciously persuade us, the readership, that we were "finally back home" after a twenty-five chapter excursion, but it definitely has had that effect.

It's been absolutely great seeing so many of the old regular supporting characters who had been missing this entire time. Nori's back (Tale 26), Tomoe's back (Tale 27), and so I'm guessing that Suigin Tou's search for Megu will occur soon and will bring Megu back into the spotlight as well. I need my Megu! She's been missing for twenty-seven straight chapters! And now that Kirakishou is dead severely weakened, you would think that Megu would be able to break out of whatever prison Kirakishou placed her in and contact Suigin Tou. Perhaps not though. The N-field can be crazy-easy to get lost in. Go, Suigin Tou! Find Megu and bring her back to our world!

It's also been incredibly surreal seeing comedy chapters again for the first time since, truly, circa Volume 6 or 7 of the original manga. Not since the shit started getting real at the end of the last series have we had a Kun-Kun episode. To have a chapter that was almost entirely dedicated to a Kun-Kun side adventure of Shinku's and Suisei Seki's was just awesome. I love my Rozen Maiden when it's all serious and dramatic, but I love my Rozen Maiden when it's hilarious and cute too! Some of the franchise's best moments are some of its most comedic, so it was great to read this chapter.

So in any event, make no mistake about it, here is what happened:

Chapters 01 thru 43: Part I, Phases 01 thru 43
Chapters 44 thru 68: Part II, Tales 01 thru 25
Chapters 69+: Part III(+?), Tales 26+


But it has all been one continuous narrative. I know you're probably sick to death of hearing me say this, but for the last time:

The second series is not a reboot nor a sequel but a direct continuation!

And now that we're out of the sidequest world, hopefully that's the last you'll hear me speak of this for quite some time.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 02:04 PM   #20
lilboocorsola
Dragon's Tears
 
lilboocorsola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Searching for light
Posts: 6,471
Watched first episode. Rather surprised that...

Spoiler: show
Shinku did not even bother trying to pass herself off as a doll to uninvolved parties - or rather that Jun didn't try harder to hide her. Usually the protagonist's magical dealings aren't revealed to family or friends until well into the story, if ever, and efforts to keep them from finding out make up half the entertainment conflict. Wonder why the decision to nonchalantly draw Jun's sister in on the loop right off the bat, and how her knowledge will affect the life-and-death battles he has to go through.
lilboocorsola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 03:14 PM   #21
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Quote:
Originally Posted by YUKI.N View Post
Watched first episode.
:o ... :o ...

Season 1 Episode 01 reply:

Spoiler: show
The dolls' behavior around humans is variable. You could argue that Shinku's bold, confident behavior is part of the reason why it was inevitable that Nori would discover Shinku was a living doll so soon.

I would say that Jun made a decent attempt at hiding Shinku from Nori. In the manga, she doesn't discover Shinku is real until after an event you've yet to see in which Jun recruits Nori's help. This event takes place at the end of Phase 02 which is the fourth published chapter of the original manga. (I had forgotten until looking just now that the series started with Prologue Part I and Prologue Part II before hitting the phases. What you just watched corresponds with Prologue Parts I and II.) The matching event in the anime doesn't occur until Episode 07. As a result of shuffling things around, with quite a few manga Volume 2 and Volume 3 chapters taking place between episodes 2 and 6, and considering Nori's role in these chapters, the writers had a choice: write Nori out of the stories and not have her discover the dolls are real until Episode 07 or else get it out of the way and have her realize that they're alive now so that she can still be a part of the same stories she was a part of in the manga. Naturally they went with the latter. Obviously you could say, "Well, it wouldn't have been a problem had they just stuck to the schedule, " but like I've mentioned before, the anime does quite a few things differently, suggesting the writers, producer, or director for the TV project wanted to tell their own version of the story rather than stringently adapt Peach Pit's.

Wish I could say more but you've only just watched the first episode. Will be a lot easier to discuss stuff once you've at least seen through Episode 03.

I'll go ahead and take this opportunity though to share some of that artwork I'd been meaning to share for a bit now.



The first one is by one of my favorite eromanga artists. Really lovely, really well-drawn. The second one strikes me as something of a Gasai Yuuno reinterpretation of Suigin Tou but I like it in spite of that because of how wonderfully the artist drew her wings. The third one is one I've shown a few people before on Pixiv but I recently rediscovered it and I really quite like it. (It's a bit large though!) The fourth one I went ahead and censored the thumbnail because it's a Season 2 end-of-series spoiler but I didn't feel like putting it into a spoiler box. Don't click it if you haven't seen the first two seasons yet! Otherwise, yeah: very pretty. The artists are 冬扇, KzcJimmy, ねこみち, and 藍·Hallelujah, respectively.

As for me, expect a manga update some time later today or tomorrow. The good news is, I finally got my hands on some nicely-scanned Japanese raws. The bad news is, the raws only go up through Tale 31, the English scanlations through Tale 36, and the manga itself is at around Tale 42 right now. Screwdom on all three fronts then. ("Not up to Japan," "Not up to Japan," and "Even Japan doesn't have closure yet. -.-") But I'm excited to read what awaits me in the final stretch of currently-available chapters. A huge cliffhanger plot twist met me at the chapter I last ended on.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2012, 12:42 PM   #22
Talon87
時の彼方へ
 
Talon87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lafayette, Indiana
Posts: 20,578
Through Tale 37 and a bit of the way into Tale 38 as well.

The shit is really hitting the fan in the Rozen Maiden world, both IRL and in-universe. First, IRL. Word on the street is that Rozen Maiden is in danger of not getting renewed for publication in Young Jump Magazine if it doesn't get a decent amount of votes in the next issue's postcard poll. Apparently it's been ranking at or near last place for the past few months and is in danger of getting axed completely. It'd be a shame if this happened. The plot arc Peach Pit has been writing for the past few years (Tales 26 thru present) clearly was meant to be the second-to-last major plot arc and set us up for one final plot arc involving the remaining key players. At the same time, it's so big in and of itself that if they had to make it the impromptu series finale, then they could. And that's what worries me. Not that it wasn't meant to be the series finale but that it both wasn't meant to be the series finale and yet could be rewritten into a series finale of sorts if they had to. I'd just as soon the series get cancelled in the middle of a plot arc, the girls get glum, the series goes into hibernation for a year or two, and then somebody picks it back up someday and they pick up where they left off.

Now, as for how the shit's hitting the fan in-universe ...

Every single picture I thought to share and possibly place outside a spoiler box, I then said, "You can't. You just can't. You'll spoil them." But some really awesome stuff has happened since I last posted. Some of it good, some of it bad, but all of it a big deal.

Spoiler: show

Jun crossing paths with Megu is arguably the second or third most anticipated event in the franchise, only behind Rosen showing up in the flesh and the Alice Game being ended one way or another. It's something fans have speculated about since before the original manga series wrapped up and in all the years since. So how did it come about? And what happened afterwards? Well, let's take a step back to where we left off last status update ...


You can run but you can't hide.

Tale 28 is one of the best manga chapters I've ever read. It hit all the comedy buttons perfectly and it was full of some beneficial plot development stuff too, what with the fancy chart Micchan drew up. But it was mostly hysterical. Awesomely hysterical. It's a shame we haven't seen Micchan since. Perhaps Peach Pit anticipated this so they decided to give Micchan a chapter to always be remembered by? But yeah ... this blew the pants off of any and all previous Micchan appearances in the manga. It wasn't the sort of humor that just anybody would get. It was a chapter rife with nods to the fans, filled to the brim with inside jokes that only long-time fans of Rozen Maiden would appreciate. But for those fans, this chapter was pure awesome.


Tale 29 was an okay Sousei and Suisei Seki chapter. I love Suisei Seki but this chapter wasn't anything very special to me. (Not like some other Suisei Seki moments we'll be discussing! ) But the end of the chapter, pictured above, was probably the single biggest "OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH YEAH! " combination "HOOOOOOO SHIT! " plot twist cliffhanger I've seen in a manga in ages. After going missing for a week (in-universe; more like 2-3 years IRL), Megu shows back up in the hospital ... but something's not quite right. O_o Anyone who knows Megu knows that ... it is not normal to see Megu like this around hospital staff. Or to be talking so happily about her father. And besides ... what is that doll doing here!? That's the creepy pseudo-Kirakishou doll we saw at the end of the alternate universe plot arc. So what is it doing here in the regular world? In Megu's possession? What need does Megu have for an ugly doll like that when she has Suigin Tou? Something's not right ...


Tale 30 was another great comedy chapter that played perfectly to the audience's funny bones and love of canon+fanon. It was wonderful to see Shinku who is normally so calm and proper freaking out when confronted by her natural enemy. It was even more wonderful to see that it was the very same cat Hina Ichigo befriended ages ago. And it was most wonderful of all to see Hina's Rosa Mystica, from inside of Shinku, communicate to her that the cat is a friend and for Shinku to then try and be friendly with it, not for herself but for Hina Ichigo.

Tale 31 introduced Toriumi Kaito, an interesting character who seems to be the latest in Kirakishou's long list of human slaves. Still, you definitely want him to become true friends with Jun. It's a shame that that's probably not what he's meant to become.

Tale 32 sees Jun attempting to go back to school, making it as far as the front gate before, poor thing, he loses consciousness. He wakes up in the school nurse's office and feels terrible shame and humiliation. However, Toriumi shows up and makes him feel better. Jun resolves to try again tomorrow. Meanwhile, in Jun's class, a new transfer student shows up. And it's ...


Are you SHITTING me ...!?

... none other than the one, the only, Kakizaki Megu. And what's this? Why did she transfer to this school? Why ...


*jaw drop*

Because she wants to meet Jun, that's why. And that's when you know: shit's goin' doooooooooooooooooooooown!

Tale 33 was an okay-good chapter that set up for Tale 34.


Tale 34 opens with Megu about to commit suicide by jumping off the school roof but being happened upon by Jun. Whether she was actually going to go through with it or not, who knows. (Seems unlikely given what is revealed later on.) In any event, something is off about Megu. She isn't the charming, sweet girl we've come to know and love when she's around Suigin Tou. She seems ... hostile, somehow. Like she's taking Jun for a ride. The chapter ends with Toriumi wanting to see the Rozen Maidens for himself and Jun stupidly agreeing to bring Toriumi over. Regardless, this chapter was the chapter in which Sakurada Jun and Kakizaki Megu finally meet. Every fan has been wondering about whether this moment would come and if it would in what manner it would come since ... well, since they first discovered Megu. For me, that'd be the second season of the anime, taking us back to the Winter 2006 season a little over six years ago. For six years I've dreamed of this encounter. And while it wasn't exactly what I had hoped for or imagined, it was still pretty damn amazing.

Tale 35 was good. Very poor English translation available but re-reading it in Japanese I was able to enjoy it much more. Basically, LaPlace's Demon leads Sousei Seki into a room where she sees flashbacks from Suigin Tou's past, specifically from the time she spent at the bottom of the Sea of Unconsciousness. After the girls chat a bit, LaPlace presents them with a mirror and tells the girls that whatever is most important to them will be revealed to them in the mirror. When Sousei Seki looks inside, she sees Jun. But ...


DUN DUN DUUUUUUUUN! What the hell does this mean!? If this is Jun, then who's the Jun on the outside? If the Jun on the outside is Jun, then who the hell is this? Things just keep getting curiouser and curiouser, don't they?


This tale was also great since we got to see Shinku interacting with Hina Ichigo's cat friend again. Loved it.

Tale 36 is a darling Suisei Seki chapter and one of my favorites. The dolls have all been interested in what "school" is ever since, like, I dunno, Volume 2 or 3 or some such. For ages they've wondered what it was like. So it was cute to see Suisei Seki's impressions of it (as influenced by a romantic shoujo manga Nori lent her) and to see her feelings towards Jun played with by Peach Pit in such a fun manner. The highlight of the chapter ...


... is definitely the scene where Jun contemplates hiding Suisei Seki in the combustible trash bin. Suisei Seki's all "Is Jun going to kiss me!? " and then next thing she knows he's unceremoniously picked her up by the waist and is preparing to dump her into the trash bin where all burnable rubbish goes. Unbelievably funny. Felt so bad for Suisei Seki there. ^^;

Tale 37 is where the shit really starts to hit the fan. I've been anxious all this time about what Peach Pit is doing with Megu. Once upon a time, I loved her and was the most ardent fan of Team Suigin Tou. I'm still rooting for Suigin Tou, but by the time I reach the start of this tale, I'm starting to lose confidence in Megu. Is she really a nice person who is just hurt and manifests that emotional damage by lashing out at the nurses and her father? Or is she just a genuine bitch? Well, thankfully ...


... Peach Pit reveals in this thrilling chapter that, while the Megu we've been seeing for the past ten chapters is in fact queen of the psycho-bitches, she's also under the effects of mind control from an unseen party, presumably Kirakishou. This would make a hell of a lot of sense since:
  • Why hasn't Megu reached out to Suigin Tou since being released from Kirakishou's prison?
  • Why is Megu the only person who's been released? Why not Yuibishi or Odile also?
  • Why does Megu have that creepy Kirakishou look-alike doll with her?
  • Why is Megu being such a heinous bitch?
  • How did Megu learn about Sakurada Jun?
All of these questions are easily answered if one assumes that Megu is under Kirakishou's spell and is being used as a tool, by Kirakishou, to try and eliminate Jun, the master of three of the seven sisters.

But anyway, whoa. There was some crazy ass foot fetishism going on in this chapter. Tons of different cels showing Megu rubbing her stinky feet all over Jun's mouth. >_< In fact, if you sneak a peek at Tale 45 (haven't read it yet), you see a flashback to this scene that once again ...


... really makes me wonder if Peach Pit aren't trying to appeal to the foot fetishist demographic.


Finally, we have the extra chapter. This shows Suigin Tou scouring every last square inch of the N field trying to find Megu while flashbacking to the time the two spent together. It was an excellent Suigin Tou + Megu chapter and it 100% restored my faith in Peach Pit's interpretation of Megu as a character / in my faith that the fans had it right and Megu really is the dear we've loved her for being. It's clear that Mind Slave Megu =/= the real Megu and that this epic plot arc, which apparently continues thru and past Tale 45, is going to see Jun and the dolls facing off against Mind Slave Megu and Toriumi Kaito.

I ended up reading Tale 37 raw first because I had run out of English scanlations ... then it turned out the English scan for 37 came out, like, two days ago. So I went ahead and got it and ... discovered that the person who's been English translating Rozen Maiden for the past ten chapters speaks worse Japanese than I did in 2006. -.- Needless to say, I was upset. But I'm more concerned for my fellow Rozen Maiden fans. I debated all evening long as to whether or not I should say anything to them on Desuchan. I'm thinking that maybe in a few months' time, if I still have Internet access and am doing okay, I will volunteer to help QC this project. For now, I'm just going to try and put the frustration of the English rewrite-translations out of my mind, go back and read the chapters I already read in English now raw instead, and press forward with the raws.

Last edited by Talon87; 05-19-2012 at 01:28 PM.
Talon87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2012, 03:02 PM   #23
lilboocorsola
Dragon's Tears
 
lilboocorsola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Searching for light
Posts: 6,471
At your request, I watched through episode 03. As battle royales go, this is pretty weird. And I say this after watching a show where people do battle with cell phones.

Episode 02:

Spoiler: show
Hina Ichigo's abandonment complex, while creepy, was interesting in that it presented a real-life psychological development in a unique context. Somewhere between a horror story where the doll is just out to claim a victim, and a genuinely tragic human tale. I wouldn't have trusted Hina were I in Tomoe's shoes, but genre-saviness does make one wary. In that sense, it's nice that this story doesn't quite fall under any one typical formula.

As alluded to, the first Alice Game seemed kinda silly. ^^; Though I suppose in a way it reminded me of Madoka. On the other hand, I was sort of expecting dark Madoka-style epicness from this show, and instead it's a lot more humorous than I anticipated. For example, the "room with the pleasant aroma and well-patterened table" was amusing. XP I'm enjoying both the lighthearted and serious aspects, and look forward to scarier/sadder things to come.


Episode 03:

Spoiler: show
So this is the infamous Suigin Tou. I didn't really have an idea of what she might sound like, but the voice suits her, I guess. Though perhaps I would've pegged her as deeper and more sulty. Wonder what her history with Shinku is to come after and toy with her like that.

I really admire how the drama is being handled in this show. Jun's implied issues and way of handling them - as well as his sister's - seem very realistic. Unlike that whiny Yukiteru. Wonder what could have caused him to become such a shut-in. It's good to see Shinku being such an immiediate positive influence in helping him repair his relationships with family and friends. Hina probably deserves some credit too as an impetus to awaken his compassion/get him out of the house, at least. (Speaking of, his disguise totally reminded me of Jinta. XD)


I should mention some of the music in this show is very nice. I'm sure there's one sentimental piece I thought was particularly beautiful. The animation is understandably lower-budget, which is a shame because the some of the manga illustrations are really gorgeous. Depending on how much I like the story, I may or may not check out the manga just for the art. Can't say I'm typically a fan of goth-loli fashion, but dem ribbons and frills.
lilboocorsola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2012, 01:45 AM   #24
Muyotwo
Dominator of Bike Levels
 
Muyotwo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,321
I watched the first season some time ago when /a/ was first obsessing over it, but I don't remember enough of it to go into much detailed discussion. It was weird, but in a good way.
__________________
The Kim Il Sung of ASB.
Muyotwo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2012, 03:45 AM   #25
Doppleganger
我が名は勇者王!
 
Doppleganger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Emina Isle
Posts: 14,199
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
That must have been in 2004, Muyo. o_O
__________________
あなたの勇気が切り開く未来
ふたりの想いが見つけだす希望
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
永遠を抱きしめて
Doppleganger is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   UPNetwork > General Forums > Anime


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:51 AM.


Design By: Miner Skinz.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.