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Old 08-24-2015, 06:38 PM   #2001
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There was really no need to call out that example Snorby because even if its used on a 2x weakness it still saves you from 2 HBs of typespam and more than paid itself.

Go sit in the corner.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:41 PM   #2002
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Uh, how do you figure? I mean I guess if they use like, a good level move it'll save you from a a good amount under 2HB in the future? You are noting that they have to use the move in question before you can imprison it, right? So like, it's only just over an HB of typespam you avoided if they use an SE Shadow Ball and then you imprison it. Don't know where you're getting 2HB from, unless I'm being a massive idiot and just missing the point, in which case I apologize in advance :p
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:44 PM   #2003
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Emi you can't complain that people are mean to you in discussions and then be disrespectful. Choose.

What I think is needed is to make it so that Imprison affects more than one move at a time - with a time limit - and can be removed like Taunt/Torment. Instantly makes it much less situational but doesn't really break it. You could keep the no Normal clause although making it XX wpuld be dumb.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:44 PM   #2004
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Yes I am.

Protect exists and I'd like to stop this silly argument.

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Emi you can't complain that people are mean to you and then be disrespectful. Choose.
I apologize.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:48 PM   #2005
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Oh not to me, to him.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:49 PM   #2006
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Yeah I know.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:53 PM   #2007
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I think right now the "seen this move recently" thing should be taken out. In most scenarios where you're using the move the opponent probably only has 2 uses (if you consider regular offtype of around ~2 significant level attacks) it really isn't as worth it to lock them out of using that particular move all of one time.

That's just my take on it.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:55 PM   #2008
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Yeah that would probably be my only change is that your opponent shouldn't have to use the move in question. I don't like Kush's version honestly and I think it makes the move a lot less useful. Less situational? Sure, but I think niche options are something that can be appreciated not "all purpose options that are wank".

On the other hand that raises the amount of butthurt people against Ghosts.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:56 PM   #2009
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Gastro Acid (PO) -- The user vomits on the opponent. Although no damage is dealt, the acid in the vomit is constructed so that that the opponent will lose any damage boosts or reductions, as well as any increases or decreases in attack effectiveness (intimidation boosts, confusion resistances) gained through their SC for the remainder of the match. No physical traits or characteristics will be lost. The user must expend a heavy amount of energy in order to perform this move.
My bad for forgetting to adjust the energy cost. That's on me. Can we all shut up now?

Oh wait now we're talking about Imprison. Ugh.
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Old 08-24-2015, 06:58 PM   #2010
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No worries Emi, my skin isn't that thin xd;

Back to Imprison, I would agree that honestly just removing the "must have recently been seen" and the bit about the glow would be good enough.

EDIT: God, Stealthy needs to get with the times :p
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:00 PM   #2011
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Actually looking at the Imprison descript now I think we could also stand to remove the no-glow-no-go policy just because it doesn't really make sense to me all that much and I think that does make it more useful (e.g. Imprisoning something like Body Slam)
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:02 PM   #2012
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Okay, for one, the no-glow-no-go bit being gotten rid of I am 100% okay with because frankly the idea of it is completely and utterly idiotic and kinda always has been.

But if we get rid of the "has to have been used recently bit" it needs replaced with some form of other restriction, likely that the user of Imprison has to have recently used the move. That way the user still gets to pick and choose moves to Imprison, but every fukken Ghost ever can't basically get away with not being able to be typespammed easily for a while without doing some form of setup first.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:03 PM   #2013
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The above would work out nicely, I think.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:04 PM   #2014
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No worries Emi, my skin isn't that thin xd;
Yeah I apologize anyways because its the correct thing to do even if I was jokingly telling you to sit in the corner and it didn't come off that way.

EDIT: NOOOOOOOO DON'T MAKE US USE THE MOVE AGAIN. THAT WAS SO AWKWARD AND FRUSTRATING.

I LITERALLY SHAT A DARK PULSE INTO A LAKE TO USE THE MOVE.

Also its not like Ghost doesn't have another counter that can fite it.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:05 PM   #2015
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While I would be fine with that it's worth noting that the only lines that get it are Chandelure, Dusknoir, Banette, Missy, Trevenant, Sableye, Spiritomb, and Yamask.

Only Dusknoir, Banette, Missy, and Sableye stand out to me as particularly good.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:07 PM   #2016
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And the rest are not particularly great. The fact is a balance needs to be found where the move is usable (so that the not great 'mon have something to do with it) but not completely and utterly ridiculous (so the great 'mon aren't even more absurdly good), and I think my proposed change makes it that way.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:08 PM   #2017
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It does! And I agree with it. Just wanted to get the ghost lines out there in case they changed anything.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:12 PM   #2018
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Well I mean it is valid but we do have the Normal type now and its not like we have a type that can literally escape every single one of its counters or something.

Like I get this puts a significant wrench in Dark-types especially ones like Malamar or Greninja but its not the most problematic thing on the planet.
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Old 08-24-2015, 07:14 PM   #2019
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[6:05:24 PM] Sprinks Sneaze: Next person to post in the Mew thread that doesn't have a shiny gold name gets stabbed.



On a more serious note, I really don't think it would be that big a deal to make the user perform the move before being able to imprison it, especially if it saves us a potentially broken element.
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Old 08-25-2015, 05:42 AM   #2020
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There should be no mention of either side having had to use a move before getting to use Imprison. It's super dumb.

If people just want to remove that clause and also the no-glow-no-go part that would work too, personally I'd prefer it killed more than one move but that's just my opinion!
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Old 08-28-2015, 06:32 PM   #2021
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Ok. Please can we change Magic Room to be its in game self now please? The current version is crap. Sorry Jeri.
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Old 08-29-2015, 03:00 AM   #2022
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Ok. Please can we change Magic Room to be its in game self now please? The current version is crap. Sorry Jeri.
I totally did not have any influence on Kush bringing this topic back up, not at all!
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Old 08-29-2015, 04:07 AM   #2023
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I've gotta disagree. Our Magic Room is great and inventive, and I think it's a great dimension to play on. We have a shitload of item moves and quite frankly most are at least semi-useless. If we institute a rule that does not allow it in Gym situations, I don't see the problem.
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Old 08-29-2015, 04:58 AM   #2024
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On the topic of something that actually does need fixing, can we allow Rototiller to always benefit the user? Only like 2 Grass lines get it and it really should help the user
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As may be expected though, our clear winner here was Kairne, ASB's champion of prioritizing the pokemon you like over those that are objectively better. I mean, one of his mains is a Watchog.
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Old 08-29-2015, 10:29 AM   #2025
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I've gotta disagree. Our Magic Room is great and inventive, and I think it's a great dimension to play on. We have a shitload of item moves and quite frankly most are at least semi-useless. If we institute a rule that does not allow it in Gym situations, I don't see the problem.
This. This so much. I don't see how changing the move to work on items makes it any better it makes it worse and we should not be actively making moves worse.
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