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Old 01-03-2015, 07:50 AM   #276
Aposteriori
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Did Spiritomb get the clause clarified about retreating into the keystone and not restoring freshness?

Edit: Will there be a damage minimum to break ghost pokemon out of the invisible state?

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Old 01-04-2015, 03:25 PM   #277
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Invisible state is time-limited, not damage-limited. It's also resticted by the fact that you can only use melee attacks while in the state which kinda... Gives your position away.
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:56 PM   #278
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Every Ghost should be able to access every state.

We could just make invisibility work like Double Team. When we let people use STAB with DT clones it immediately became plausiplausible that you might order it.
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Old 01-04-2015, 04:35 PM   #279
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Not sure on the the every-ghost-every-state thing. I mean, it's not like we give every poison Garbabor's SC- it's more of a Species Characteristic than a Type Characteristic, in my mind.

Invisibility is kinda fine as is. You're locked out of ranged moves, so generally all you're getting from it is a round or two of status damage or an accuracy boost to your melee attacks.
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People should watch what they enjoy regardless of what others think, even if it's a terribad guilty pleasure.
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 01-04-2015, 04:41 PM   #280
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I don't understand why that is relevant.

Yeah invisibility works well enough it's just something we could try if we wanted. Personally I'd prefer STAB including ranged moves as I don't really know why we make you melee attacks only as is but ghosts are already a stupid type to have to balance so meh.
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Old 01-04-2015, 04:53 PM   #281
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Because the state they can achieve should be based off the Pokemon in question, not their typing imop. Which also provides moving-forwards support for non-ghost pokemon with the ability to change forms. And it's easy to balance a pokemon 'losing out on states'. Like, a permasolid pokemon like Trenevant could have it's bark serve as armour of sorts, reducing damage from physical attacks.

I think the main issue with giving ghosts ranged moves while invisible is that it's really easy to abuse simply by passively moving while firing off attacks, since at range you can actually move enough to make it hard for your opponent to get a lock on you inbetween when you fire your attack and they attempt to retaliate.
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 01-04-2015, 05:06 PM   #282
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Well I mean its different from the Garbodor example. Garbodor is not an excellent Pokemon and I don't think anyone would approve of a better Poison-type like Drapion getting a significant buff (as unlikely as it is to ever happen). This isn't the same for Ghosts. It's always been that the best Ghosts have gotten access to all the states except for Missy with invisible (I approve) and the weaker Ghosts have gotten shafted in that regard. In addition, so many Ghost-type Pokemon have shown these states that extrapolating that all Ghosts can use them isn't too far off, especially when the purpose is too buff the weaker Ghosts and give them a reason to be used.
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Old 01-04-2015, 05:10 PM   #283
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Also if you were assigning states from the ground up and had never seen the anime, this would be less of an issue because you sure as hell wouldn't let the really good Pokémon go invisible.
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Old 01-04-2015, 07:11 PM   #284
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Fair, the anime does kinda throw a wrench in things.

Free states for everyone!
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Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
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Old 01-23-2015, 04:40 PM   #285
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Did we get to the point where this was acceptable?
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Old 01-23-2015, 04:48 PM   #286
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I think we did? Other than states for Shedinja plox
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Old 01-23-2015, 05:09 PM   #287
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Ghost rules are live. SCs will be updated soon.
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Old 01-23-2015, 07:50 PM   #288
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Oh I was going to look this over this weekend and give feedback but okay.
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Old 01-26-2015, 10:13 PM   #289
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A brief rundown of all issues I can spot with the current writeup.

1. Dear god please just let Yamask, Cofagrigus, and Spiritomb make their physical objects able to become ethereal for some form of energy cost. They're already terrible in comparison to most Ghosts and they really don't need to suffer from "worst of both worlds" syndrome. We let the Honedge line and even the Golett line do it so it makes no sense to not let these.

2. You list Pain Split as usable whilst invisible, despite it being a Normal type move that isn't status based, so that either needs removed or clarified a bit better that there may be some other moves usuable while invisible. I'd say just allow drains and you're probably fine there.

3. You should probably note somewhere that using Selfdestruct and Explosion force the Ghost solid, as currently it just says they can't be used whilst ethereal and it's probably best to just not have people making the idea that Gastly flat out can't use the moves.

4. Shuppet and Banette really need written better with how Curse works. A simple "Shuppet/Banette sacrifice half the amount of health they normally would when using Curse, but the target will take damage as though they had sacrificed the full amount." will likely suffice.

5. Spiritomb's SC is a little poorly worded and redundant in that it mentions that they are weighed down by the Keystone but still able to do X twice, and that can be combined into one thing.

6. Frillish and Jellicent need a note about how well they swim, otherwise the fact that they aren't very mobile while levitating will likely be taken to cross over to their movement underwater.

7. A 10% reduction in damage is piddle compared to making Honedge and Doublade immobile. At the very least please specify that it simply slows them so we don't have people reffing them completely unable to move while like this.

8. Please be a bit more specific with the health amounts for the different sizes for Pumpkaboo and Gourgeist. People are genuinely sick of hearing things from "Super has Good health more than normal" to "Super has Extreme health more than normal" because people are terrible at having brains.

9. It should probably be noted in Spiritomb's SC that they are even more resistant to curses than Ghosts normally are, since that's already a Ghost SC thing.
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Old 01-31-2015, 01:13 PM   #290
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Appropriate edits have been made.
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Old 01-31-2015, 01:16 PM   #291
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>Last Edited by Jerichi; 1-23-2015

Er...
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Old 01-31-2015, 01:20 PM   #292
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On the site, silly face.
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Old 01-31-2015, 01:35 PM   #293
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Excuse me for not being used to things magically ending up on the site on their own.
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Old 02-19-2016, 08:56 PM   #294
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Okay I think its been the required amount of time.

Can we allow ethereal Ghosts to use XX physical attacks? It's really stupid that they take damage from them but yet can't use them.

How does "can turn ethereal for a few seconds" work with "only one Ghost change a round"? I mean its on some of the worse Ghosts so I'm not complaining so much as in this is probably confusing for refs.

Can we just give all Ghosts some form of invisibility like we were discussing? There isn't much of a reason to be super restrictive about this.

Why don't Honedge and Doublade have a bigger defense bonus?

Did we fix stuff like Spiritomb not being able to make its keystone ethereal?
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:01 PM   #295
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While we are at it can we make ghosts also resistant to either normal or XX moves? It goes from having fighting and normal as immunitys ingame (i know ingame isnt the best thing to go off) to taking neutral damage in ASB. Fighting being neutral is fine/good as it stops the likes of Sableye and Spiritomb from being OP but ghost only has two resistances in ASB so surely giving them another wouldnt hurt
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:02 PM   #296
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Can we get rid of ghost states and make stuff like invisible a sig or a badge instead?
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:06 PM   #297
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While we are at it can we make ghosts also resistant to either normal or XX moves? It goes from having fighting and normal as immunitys ingame (i know ingame isnt the best thing to go off) to taking neutral damage in ASB. Fighting being neutral is fine/good as it stops the likes of Sableye and Spiritomb from being OP but ghost only has two resistances in ASB so surely giving them another wouldnt hurt
You may have missed the part where they get what is essentially a full resistance to every physical move ever in ethereal.
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:10 PM   #298
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You may have missed the part where they get what is essentially a full resistance to every physical move ever in ethereal.
Not all of them and that is easily exploitable by people who know what they are doing. It is a good point though, just thought it might be worth discussing while we are discussing stuffs
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:17 PM   #299
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>Resistance to Normal Energy

No, please stop.
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Old 02-19-2016, 09:17 PM   #300
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Can we get rid of ghost states and make stuff like invisible a sig or a badge instead?
Sure, if you want to make a lot of Ghost-types super awful, go ahead.

Why do I have to repeat this point all the fucking time
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