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Old 05-25-2009, 06:34 PM   #1
Balmund
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4x weaknesses z0mg

I've been wondering about this for a while. The thing is, I have a problem against 4x weaknesses. A big one. Not so ingame itself, as the 4 move restriction perfectly balances that out. But in a game were pokes have access to their entire move repertoire, being 4x weak to anything is a huge disadvantage. Because of this, type advantages seem to be far mor important in ASB than in any other pokemon game ever.

Why thank you thar Mr. Balmund, master of the obvious. But other than whining about this, what do you propose?

Well, I propose toning down 4x weaknesses or at least to consider why X poke would be more weak to X type of attacks than Y poke. Why should a Gyarados take twice as much damage from Electric attacks than, say, a Starmie? A Gible weaker to Ice than a Dratini or a Bagon? A Graveler suffer so much more to Water/Grass than a Probopass? A Shiftry to Bug when compared to a Ludicolo? Why does a Parasect burn far more than an Gloom? And so forth. I suggest that, while keeping the established weaknesses resistances, we should limit bonus damage from all SE attacks to 2x thus possibly balancing things out and perhaps making things more intresting.

I'll probably get lectured on how any X poke can beat Y on the hands of legendary trainers of Kuno's caliber. But I must insist. If what I suggest seems just too unreasonable, pray tell me why so.

You may shoot for the kill now.
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Old 05-25-2009, 07:53 PM   #2
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*picks up 44-caliber and takes aim*

The simple answer to ur plight is to not pull out 'mon that have 4x weaknesses against the possible moves in the movesets of the opponents 'mon. Or you just don't use 'mon with 4x weaknesses unless there is no chance of them taking much 4x damage.

For example, in my squad at the moment, I have both a Snover and a Rhyhorn. both of whom have 4x weaknesses. they will appear from time to time in my squad of 6, but will only appear in battle against matchups where i wont be taking 4x damage. My rhyhorn kicked ass against a Magby once. And my Snover will destroy Flying types. etc
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Old 05-25-2009, 07:56 PM   #3
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Or you man up and take it.
Also this is the wrong Suggestion and Inquiries thread lololol.

Also my Heracross beat a Tropius, so there.
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Old 05-25-2009, 07:56 PM   #4
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Graveler

Well, in ASB, a fully charged Focus Punch doesn't OHKO a Shieldon if that's what you're asking.

We've already toned it down some.

>My rhyhorn kicked ass against a magby

It was a draw, plus you had a type advantage already :x
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Old 05-25-2009, 08:10 PM   #5
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Well, yes. but it was on a stupid water arena thanks to the feffing shifting stadium and the dumb ref not telling us what the arena was before picking the 'mon...Oh, and while Im at it, we still need to have a rematch to settle that score...
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Old 05-25-2009, 09:55 PM   #6
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>Also my Heracross beat a Tropius, so there.

But you're Weetos. It's different.

Meh, I supposed I twas gonna get something ala "be a man and just faight!". At least I got it out of my system.

>Also this is the wrong Suggestion and Inquiries thread lololol.

Is that so? Shi. Sorry
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:07 AM   #7
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I actually don't have a real problem with a lowering of the max damage to maybe 3x. It'll be discussed.
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Old 05-26-2009, 07:58 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dosuser
Metagro├č: Male Beldum
Metagro├č is a totally metal dude. One day, Kuno's voice boomed out, "YOUR STRUGGLE TOTALLY MAKES YOU METAL." This benediction fueled Metagro├č' determination to keep struggling to the very end. In his neverending struggle to fulfill his destiny, Metagro├č sought out Morg for enlightenment. Morg looked with respect upon Metagro├č' tireless struggle and permitted him to train alongside his Magikarp. Now, Metagro├č has learned not to be mastered by its struggle, but to be the master of its Struggle.
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Old 05-26-2009, 08:28 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muyotwo View Post
I actually don't have a real problem with a lowering of the max damage to maybe 3x. It'll be discussed.
This is a good idea imo, although my opinions are seldom necessary. Recently Type-spam has made people reject pokemon due to 4x weakness altogether, I myself considered dropping Charizard.
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Old 05-27-2009, 08:22 AM   #10
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Scyther is still cooler than Scizor, though, if only barely
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Old 05-27-2009, 08:23 AM   #11
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Shouldn't we have a S&I: General btw?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dosuser
Metagro├č: Male Beldum
Metagro├č is a totally metal dude. One day, Kuno's voice boomed out, "YOUR STRUGGLE TOTALLY MAKES YOU METAL." This benediction fueled Metagro├č' determination to keep struggling to the very end. In his neverending struggle to fulfill his destiny, Metagro├č sought out Morg for enlightenment. Morg looked with respect upon Metagro├č' tireless struggle and permitted him to train alongside his Magikarp. Now, Metagro├č has learned not to be mastered by its struggle, but to be the master of its Struggle.
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Old 05-27-2009, 02:01 PM   #12
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Jumpluff

As a dirty dirty typespammer myself, I kinda like the idea. As much as I'd like to say "Be a man and FAIGHT!" (to steal Balmund's words) there's only so much some Pokemon can do in these situations.
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Old 05-27-2009, 02:35 PM   #13
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The large majority of Pokemon that have x4 weaknesses are massive powerhouses or have gigantic movesets. And more often than not, the Pokemon will have an arsenal of moves to deal with Pokemon of the type it's weak to (i.e. Marshtomp getting strong Ice moves), which really makes it so that if they get toned down, they end up getting a bit of an advantage.
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Old 05-27-2009, 02:47 PM   #14
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>The large majority of Pokemon that have x4 weaknesses are massive powerhouses or have gigantic movesets.

FEAR THE WRATH OF NUMEL AND JUMPLUFF!
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Old 05-27-2009, 02:53 PM   #15
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I don't remember saying "all", and the few that don't have giant movesets are still useable, you just have to have a little strategy with them. After all, that is the point of ASB, is it not?
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Old 05-27-2009, 03:03 PM   #16
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You said the large majority, which is completely wrong.
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Old 05-27-2009, 03:10 PM   #17
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Really? Go ahead and tell me all the x4 weak 'mon lines that either aren't complete powerhouses or have large movesets. Prove me wrong with your handful of Bug types with a couple others thrown in.

Edit: My point is, the handicap is really unnecessary. If you feel you need a handicap, throw it in a Sig move, that's what they're for, giving you an advantage in battle.

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Old 05-27-2009, 03:39 PM   #18
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The following PokÚmon have a x4 weakness. As well as some I probably forgot, but meh. Can you honestly expect me to believe the "vast majority" of these mon are massive powerhouses with huge movepools?

Charizard
Butterfree
Parasect
Golem
Exeggutor
Gyarados
Omastar
Kabutops
Dragonite
Ledian
Jumpluff
Quagsire
Forretress
Scizor
Heracross
Magcargo
Delibird
Mantine
Tyranitar
Swampert
Beautifly
Shiftry
Pelipper
Masquerain
Breloom
Ninjask
Aggron
Camerupt
Flygon
Cacturne
Altaria
Whiscash
Tropius
Relicanth
Salamence
Torterra
Bastiodon
Wormadam-G
Wormadam-S
Mothim
Vespiquen
Gastrodon
Garchomp
Toxicroak
Abomasnow
Magnezone
Rhyperior
Yanmega
Probopass
Articuno
Moltres
Celebi
Heatran
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Old 05-27-2009, 04:18 PM   #19
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You forgot about Ho-oh.
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Old 05-27-2009, 04:28 PM   #20
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Ho-oh is no longer acquirable in PASBL. Ditto for Rayquaza.
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Old 05-27-2009, 04:37 PM   #21
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Your words hurt me.
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Old 05-27-2009, 04:38 PM   #22
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ficksed.
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Superior Christmas Banner is Superior.
Also still looking for ref with brain, although not just now due to Tyranidos running in fear.
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Old 05-27-2009, 07:47 PM   #23
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Actually, from the perspective of being able to deal with the 4x weakness, at least 3/4 of those on the list actually have decent enough movesets to cope well with their 4x weaknesses. I dont think it's worthwhile changing the max damage a 'mon can take. It's how they are. They have to learn to cope with the 4x weakness they get. It also takes away the fun of using one and still winning, even against a 'mon who ca spam the attack type of the 4x weakness. That is the real challenge. I propose it stays as it is.
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Old 05-27-2009, 07:50 PM   #24
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I think 4x weakness has come to the point when people stop using pokemon because they have a 4x weakness, personally I don't think this is a good thing, I see the possible lowering of damage as a good thing, at 3x it still does a lot more than regular super effective attacks, but not enough to completely discourage the use of the pokemon.
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Old 05-27-2009, 09:09 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZoraJolteon View Post
The following PokÚmon have a x4 weakness. As well as some I probably forgot, but meh. Can you honestly expect me to believe the "vast majority" of these mon are massive powerhouses with huge movepools?

Charizard - powerhouse
Butterfree - decent moveset in terms of statuses
Parasect - decent moveset in terms of statuses
Golem - potential powerhouse if used right
Exeggutor - could use some work, but is still useable
Gyarados - powerhouse
Omastar - decently large moveset
Kabutops - decently large moveset
Dragonite - powerhouse
Ledian - not that great, though there is potential - 1
Jumpluff - could use work, still useable
Quagsire - plenty of anti-Grass moves, and a decent moveset
Forretress - could use work, still useable
Scizor - large physical moveset
Heracross - large physical moveset
Magcargo - not that great, though there is potential - 2
Delibird - could use work, still useable
Mantine - could use work, still useable
Tyranitar - powerhouse
Swampert - powerhouse
Beautifly - not that great, though there is potential - 3
Shiftry - could use work, still useable
Pelipper - could use work, still useable
Masquerain - plenty of anti Rock moves, and a decent enough moveset
Breloom - large physical moveset
Ninjask - could use work, still useable
Aggron - powerhouse
Camerupt - could use work, still useable
Flygon - large and varied moveset
Cacturne - pretty decent moveset
Altaria - pretty decent moveset
Whiscash - could use work, still useable
Tropius - pretty decent moveset
Relicanth - decent moveset
Salamence - powerhouse
Torterra - powerhouse
Bastiodon - pretty decent moveset
Wormadam-G - not great, but has potential - 4
Wormadam-S - not great, but has potential - 5
Mothim - not great, but has potential - 6
Vespiquen - could use work, still useable
Gastrodon - plenty of anti Grass moves in a decent moveset
Garchomp - powerhouse
Toxicroak - large physical moveset
Abomasnow - large special moveset, though could use work
Magnezone - not great, but has potential - 7
Rhyperior - powerhouse
Yanmega - could use work, still useable
Probopass - could use work, still useable
Articuno - Legendary with large moveset
Moltres - Legendary with large moveset
Celebi - Legendary with large moveset
Heatran - Legendary with large moveset
Final count: 7

Hooray, 5 Bug types, Magcargo, and the Magnezone line, with a few others if you so choose, exactly as I said. And all of those have potential with some decent sigs.

Seriously, if you have an issue with massive damage being done to your Pokemon through super effective damage, give them a sig to tone it down, or give them a sig to counter it or something. It's not difficult.
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