UPNetwork  

Go Back   UPNetwork > General Forums > Debate

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-27-2015, 10:25 PM   #26
Doppleganger
我が名は勇者王!
 
Doppleganger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Emina Isle
Posts: 14,198
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
I'm not sure I buy the hogging argument. It isn't correct to assume zero sum, that a woman who is the fifth wife of a sultan becomes your bride if polygamy is outlawed. There's also the argument that marriage as an institution is failing (like in Japan) and as technology becomes more advanced, we get more people moving away from falling in love with real girls with imperfections and more falling for flawless AI angels.

Because if one buys the argument that love is completely in the mind, why should I bother with a real girl when in twenty years I could have a Persona?
__________________
あなたの勇気が切り開く未来
ふたりの想いが見つけだす希望
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
永遠を抱きしめて
Doppleganger is offline  
Old 06-27-2015, 11:26 PM   #27
Slash
Silver LO
 
Slash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Tokyo Underground Sewage Facility
Posts: 6,760
Send a message via Yahoo to Slash Send a message via Skype™ to Slash
Dewott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Talon87 View Post
On the issue of incest, I see no compelling reason to outlaw incest between consenting adults. "Oh no, what about genetics? " is not a good enough answer to bar relatives from marrying one another. A, because if it were, then we'd have to also go around barring any and all genetic losers from marrying, and we certainly don't do that either. And B, because even if we were to strike out A, we still couldn't rule out the possibility that couples would willingly go through with sterilization if it meant getting to be meaningfully married to the love of their life. (You don't have to remove his goddamn balls or her goddamn uterus. A simple vasectomy coupled with a simple [Fallopian] tubal ligation is plenty good enough. Allows them to still have kids some day, too, should they ever decide to have kids with somebody else.)
That's quite a controversial opinion, and I completely agree.

Also, yeah, this is two debates, not one. And let's not slippery slope this
__________________
--- ---
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneezey12 View Post
KAIRNE I WILL RIP OFF YOUR SCROTUM AND FEED IT TO YOU THROUGH A FUCKING SWIRLY STRAW.

Slash is offline  
Old 06-28-2015, 12:18 AM   #28
Doppleganger
我が名は勇者王!
 
Doppleganger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Emina Isle
Posts: 14,198
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
Something else I'd like to bring up (related to an anti-semetic video BPK told me about) is that historically, people in office within the US have kept out "extremists" to prevent regime (cultural) changes similar to legalizing incest/polygamy.

For example, fundamentalist Christians in their modern form have been around since John Calvin. Freemasons were well aware of the dangers in letting such people get control of public office. So for years, things like county boundary lines and informal cliques (basically organization) kept fundamentalists out of power. Freemasonry was quickly superseded by the far more secular political party, which by its nature has to adopt a more centrist view to grab the majority of voters. It took two hundred years for fundamentalists to organize into a cohesive voting bloc.

How's this relevant...well in the early 2000's there were a lot of speculative AI movies, and one was Simone. The movie was about CGI stars eventually replacing real actors/actresses. At the time, the MPAA was alarmed by the concept. They forced the director, who intended to use a (primitive by today's standards) CGI woman as the star, cast a real model as the star. So here you have an example of an organization using enforcement to curb technological innovation in the interest of the attitudes of the day. In all the cases we see a very organized unit acting as gatekeeper, while politics are becoming increasingly more grassroots as time goes on.

Things like Miku are still pretty primitive right now, but I wonder what direction the future holds. Will voters of today, thinking of tomorrow, put their feet down to reaffirm the illegality, or will they alleviate the pain of today's suffering by liberalizing the laws?
__________________
あなたの勇気が切り開く未来
ふたりの想いが見つけだす希望
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
永遠を抱きしめて
Doppleganger is offline  
Old 06-28-2015, 11:38 AM   #29
Shuckle
Problematic Fave
 
Shuckle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: VA
Posts: 3,199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
Another one is where there's an enormous guy (6'4", 230 lbs) and a tiny girl (4'9", 110 lbs).
Dopple why do you literally hate me

Also it's good to take a measured attitude towards progress. As great as it is for people and technology to move forward, throwing caution to the winds for the sake of advancement led to some pretty serious issues.

European countries should claim as much land as possible!
The United States needs to expand all the way to the west!
Democracy must be brought to every nation of the world!

In each of these cases, the people involved rushed recklessly into progress and advancement, caring little to none for the people and culture they crushed in their way. Is that going to happen here? I don't know. I think we have learned from the mistakes of yesteryear, and there is a very real possibility that rushing ourselves into progress is what we need to do.

However, what is your opinion on AI rights? If there is a sentient AI, is that AI a person? Does that make them illegal to kill? Is it okay to make them work for no pay? Wouldn't that be slavery? What if an AI doesn't want to work anymore? Does that mean that the owner of the AI can kill that AI?

There's so much that isn't available to us right now. We feel invincible and informed on every single account, but it's not nearly true. Jurassic Park and The Lorax really should tell you that bigger and faster is not always better, but I guess people don't think that message applies to "good" things like big business the right kinds of progress.
__________________

Last edited by Shuckle; 06-28-2015 at 11:45 AM.
Shuckle is offline  
Old 06-28-2015, 04:21 PM   #30
Kindrindra
大事なのは自分らしいくある事
 
Kindrindra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Determined
Posts: 5,840
Yeah I'm of the opinion that assuming childbirth is just an uneven field in every regard. We already have laws against Pedophilia and the like preventing the truly despicable kind of Incest, so what's wrong with allowing people to marry those they love regardless of other circumstances? Zelphy raises a valid point, but Talon's counterpoint is equally strong, and honestly we can just ban incestuous childbirth if that's an issue.


I also agree with everything Shuckle said though. And disagree with most things Dopple said (sorry!)- In no way are men as a whole Polygamous and women Monogamous, that's something exclusive to individual people, and in my experience I've actually met MORE women who would prefer a polygamous lifestyle than men, and more men who would prefer a monogamous lifestyle than women. Also it would take AGES to program an AI with a human-like personality, so that's not really an issue, and I also don't have any issue with people literally marrying their future electronic waifus.
__________________
PASBL(TL: 4 RL: B-) --- FB (Kin Blackstone) --- WF (Adelie Fleur)
Quote:
Originally Posted by captainmisato View Post
People should watch what they enjoy regardless of what others think, even if it's a terribad guilty pleasure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
Though, I also dislike the concept of lamenting the current day while wishing to re-experience the past. At least, my modern attitude is to try and make each new day magical even if it's not, since exclusively reminiscing about the past is too pathetic.
Kindrindra is offline  
Old 06-28-2015, 04:32 PM   #31
Doppleganger
我が名は勇者王!
 
Doppleganger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Emina Isle
Posts: 14,198
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kindrindra View Post
In no way are men as a whole Polygamous and women Monogamous, that's something exclusive to individual people, and in my experience I've actually met MORE women who would prefer a polygamous lifestyle than men, and more men who would prefer a monogamous lifestyle than women.
You mis-understand. Men are biologically designed to be polygamous, women are monogamous. Men produce hundreds of million of sperm per ejaculate and are capable of easily impregnating lots of women over a short period of time and don't have to care for the offspring. Women can only be fertilized by one man and spend 9 months incubating the one baby. Biology wants women to find a mate who sticks with her to raise the child. That same biology encourages men to engage in pump and dump schemes. Relationships are an equilibrium between the biological imperatives and cultural/personal attitudes.
__________________
あなたの勇気が切り開く未来
ふたりの想いが見つけだす希望
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
永遠を抱きしめて
Doppleganger is offline  
Old 06-28-2015, 04:34 PM   #32
Deebs
You sayin' I like dudes?
 
Deebs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: KY
Posts: 1,898
Send a message via Skype™ to Deebs
Man this thread is the worst.
__________________
Deebs is offline  
Old 06-28-2015, 04:37 PM   #33
Jerichi
プラスチック♡ラブ
 
Jerichi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: 蒸気の波の中
Posts: 14,766
Okay this thread has outstayed the little welcome it has.

If you want to debate these separate issues separately, you can make separate threads.

And let's not conflate polygamy (the practice of one man taking multiple wives, with a heavy undertone of religiously-motivated patriarchy) and polyamory (people who have more than one committed romantic relationship) next time we do this.
Jerichi is offline  
Closed Thread

Lower Navigation
Go Back   UPNetwork > General Forums > Debate


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:16 AM.


Design By: Miner Skinz.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.