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Old 05-02-2019, 11:37 PM   #276
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@Shuckle
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The whole point of putting the stones back was because didn't want to change the past because it would create a contradictory timeline. The Ancient One states this as the reason for not giving up the Time Stone initially. Losing Thanos contradicts everything from like Guardians of the Galaxy and everything after. The Guardians wouldn't form up as a team. Ronin wouldn't have attacked Zandar. Ego wouldn't find Peter. The whole Infinity War film.

I don't know the proper repercussions of destroying a stone, but considering they destroyed the Mind Stone and like, no minds were destroyed followed by Thanos destroying all the stones in this film, I'm pretty sure it wasn't necessary for universal survival.


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This is why I credit the film for being a strong character film. The surrounding scenario just allows our characters to explore themselves rather than something I'm taking seriously. There's a whole scene in the film itself where it acknowledges that time travel is messy and we shouldn't bring any prior film bias (i.e. Back to the Future or Bill & Ted) into this film and not take it too seriously.

The bigger issues is Thanos in Infinity War with 4/6 stones has a hard fight against the Guardians, Dr. Strange, Spidey, and Iron-Man, but in this film, he completely outmatches Thor (albeit out of shape but with two Asgardian weapons), Captain America, and Iron-Man at the same time. It felt more like a gratuitous action scene, which I feel like the film also kind of mocks earlier (Hulk mentions he finds the need for him to smash stuff to be gratuitous).

Another issue was that Thanos had use the power of Dwarves' neutron star to forge the gauntlet, but now Iron-Man just makes one out of Iron-Man nanites. This overall was kind of lame for me since in the comics, the Gauntlet is just Thanos' glove. It wasn't special. He just socketed his normal glove and it became the iconic Infinity Gauntlet. They make a big deal about it in Infinity War, but it's pretty insignificant in this film.


The sheer fact that this film has a space energy woman, giant green strong man, and a size changing thief work together to fight a purple scrotum man, I'm pretty sure we all turned off parts of our brain already.
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Old 05-02-2019, 11:50 PM   #277
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Another issue was that Thanos had use the power of Dwarves' neutron star to forge the gauntlet, but now Iron-Man just makes one out of Iron-Man nanites. This overall was kind of lame for me since in the comics, the Gauntlet is just Thanos' glove. It wasn't special. He just socketed his normal glove and it became the iconic Infinity Gauntlet. They make a big deal about it in Infinity War, but it's pretty insignificant in this film.
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2014 Thanos was Thanos in his prime. By 2018, he's old and tired, and can't be arsed anymore.

If there's anything more annoying than that, I would direct your ire toward Stormbringer overcoming the Infinity Gauntlet + 5 stones during Infinity War. The whole bit that "Thanos didn't know what it was!" is incredibly stupid. I would have preferred that Groot's arm added a synergistic power to the Strombringer than nobody could have predicted, since that's actually plausible, while Thanos choking is not.
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Old 05-03-2019, 12:56 PM   #278
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This is Marvel comic knowledge, but Stormbreaker and Mjolnir are made of Uru, which is immune to energy projections, which is why Thanos' attempt to stop the axe with an energy blast from the Infinity Gauntlet (six stones btw) doesn't work. He's caught by surprise and takes the axe to his chest. I know this is outside knowledge from the film and I normally am against that, but I also concede that there's no way a movie can explain everything in the runtime. We never get the full explanation of Cap's vibranium shield abilities, we don't get the full rundown on how each iteration of the Iron Man suits work, we don't know how the Infinity Stones work either, we simply know they're powerful. These aren't really demerits and we discover their abilities by watching the film itself.

Arguing that four years has taken Thanos out of his prime is ridiculous. Why did he waste his prime years not getting the stones then? He didn't eat ice cream and drink beer for four years. We see he's still strong without using the stones' power when he defeats the Hulk in Infinity War, but now with Tony Stark with probably the same firepower that forced Thanos to bring a moon down on him in the last film, can't defeat a stone-less Thanos? And he's backed up by a dual Uru weapon Thor and even Captain America and he just spanks them?
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Old 05-05-2019, 03:30 PM   #279
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@Shuckle
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The whole point of putting the stones back was because didn't want to change the past because it would create a contradictory timeline. The Ancient One states this as the reason for not giving up the Time Stone initially. Losing Thanos contradicts everything from like Guardians of the Galaxy and everything after. The Guardians wouldn't form up as a team. Ronin wouldn't have attacked Zandar. Ego wouldn't find Peter. The whole Infinity War film.

I don't know the proper repercussions of destroying a stone, but considering they destroyed the Mind Stone and like, no minds were destroyed followed by Thanos destroying all the stones in this film, I'm pretty sure it wasn't necessary for universal survival.
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"The Infinity stones create what you experience as the flow of time. Remove one stone and that flow splits. Now, this may benefit your reality but my new one, not so much. In this new branched reality, without our chief weapon against the forces of darkness, our world will be over run. Millions will suffer. So, tell me Doctor, can your science prevent all that?"

Okay this interpretation makes a little more sense - it's not that the past was changed, because it would just create a new timeline with no Time Stone. It's that without the Time Stone, Dormammu would bring about an apocalypse-level event and bring the Dark Dimension online and doom everyone. The Sorcerer Supreme prevents that from happening with the use of magic arts and the Time Stone. The Time Stone's return is not important to the alpha timeline, it's important to the alternate reality that was created by the removal of the timeline.

Thanos getting snapped along with his army creates a timeline where there is no Thanos. This timeline could be doomed, but I doubt it (it's really not like Thanos represents a defense against some threat. While he's "altruistic" in his motives, it's made pretty clear that he's dangerous and cruel, dead set on the slaughtering of half of all living things with no other possible use for the stones in his mind - seriously, could he not just double the resources for everyone?? He has so much power to build, and all he does with it is destroy).

As a result, the only illogical development was Cap going into the parallel reality, putting back the stones, and then entering an alternate reality where he lives the rest of his life with his beau, but somehow rejoins the alpha timeline to give the shield to the Falcon? Why was he there? In the Endgame timeline, Cap never returned from his mission and never lived out his life with Carter.
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Old 05-05-2019, 04:22 PM   #280
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Doubling the resources is worthless. Thomas Malthus created a model for population growth, and population increases exponentially while resources are linear. There's also entropic concerns when simply creating matter out of nothing, which is going to raise the energy level of the universe.

Having not watched the movie, I don't know if Thanos simply killed half of all life or if he killed half of all sentient life. The latter is like pissing in the ocean: the species will rebound in a matter of generations. The former could be more dire since it means he kills livestock and harvests, meaning there's a higher likelihood of keystone extinctions and localized apocalypses.

My take on the whole snap has been "Thanos might not have been right, but he's less wrong than the people criticizing him".
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Old 05-06-2019, 10:02 AM   #281
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The new Spider-Man: Far from Home trailer came out. It's looking good. Huge Avengers: Endgame spoilers though.

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There's a moment that perfectly described Spider-man in almost all his versions, but probably best applies to the comic and Tom Holland version.

Peter: "Why do you want me? Your friendly neighborhood Spider-man?
Nick Fury: "Bitch please! You've been in space!"

Spidey always feels like he's a small time local hero even though he has defeat many high powered villains and stopped many world ending events. Spidey has even briefly hosted the Enigma Force which is second only to the Infinity Gems.
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Old 05-06-2019, 11:21 AM   #282
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Infinity Gems are inferior to the Heart of the Universe!
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Old 05-06-2019, 11:34 AM   #283
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And Heart of the Universe isn't comic canon.
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Old 05-06-2019, 01:42 PM   #284
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Canon in comics means about as much as a Latin American government - it's torn down and reset every few years after a change in power. What matters is that Jim Starlin wrote it and it exists - two qualities that mean it isn't easily dismissed by what an editor says.
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Old 05-06-2019, 04:00 PM   #285
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Then that means because I wrote a fanfiction with Jackie Chan as the greatest superhero, no one can dispute it because I wrote it.

EDIT: Using actual comics as an example, we've had the Punisher, Deadpool, and Wolverine destroy their era of the Marvel Universe. Yes, those three have separately killed all the heroes and characters, not all 'on screen.' That doesn't meant that in realistic terms, they could actually destroy the Marvel Universe and all their heroes. Especially since Punisher is just a regular human with military training and guns, Deadpool only has super regeneration and guns, and Wolverine has super regeneration and indestructible bones and claws. None of these are epic tier characters capable of stop heroes of power levels like Silver Surfer or the Sentry or Thor. Canon is necessary to keeps things at a proper power level.

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Old 12-11-2020, 02:00 AM   #286
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Maybe Loki can give me some insight but if not, someone redpill me on injustice.

What is it, why is it talked about A LOT lately, and how is is relevant to the Timmverse/DCAU?
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Old 12-11-2020, 07:20 AM   #287
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Maybe Loki can give me some insight but if not, someone redpill me on injustice.

What is it, why is it talked about A LOT lately, and how is is relevant to the Timmverse/DCAU?
*raises hand* Resident (relatively new) DCAU expert here. I don't know a lot about Injustice but basically I believe it originated as a "dark AU" fighting game series which spawned a comic book, wherein Superman turns "evil" and kills the Joker after being tricked into killing his own pregnant wife Lois. Superman goes on to try and become Kira from Death Note, gaining some superhero followers while others join Batman's team to stop him.

The Justice League animated series did explore a similar plotline where the JL traveled to an alternate universe and found their other selves had become the "Justice Lords": ruling the world with an iron fist and carrying out strict capital punishment for criminals (or rather, lobotomizing many of the dangerous ones so they became harmless). This stemmed from Superman killing Luthor in revenge for Flash's death, although "Lord Batman" ended up going along with the dictatorship this time (but was eventually convinced by his counterpart to defect and help take down the regime).
Injustice may have been directly inspired by it, although according to commentary it looks like the Justice Lords were originally meant to be a "Crime Syndicate" story but ended up being more a reference to "The Authority" (both names I'm not familiar with so there ends my explanation).
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Old 12-11-2020, 11:12 AM   #288
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Yeah LBC got it. They're not related to Timmverse or DCAU.

It originally started as Team Superman vs Team Batman, which was mostly the metahumans against the regular humans. Then Superman started using super villains to fight Team Batman. Then Batman got a Superman pill to temporarily turn normal humans into Superman levels of power (which famously has the scene of Alfred kicking the shit out of Superman) and then the pills ran out and Batman turned to the magic community to help promote Justice League Dark and then I stopped caring cause everything was super crazy.
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Old 12-20-2020, 01:06 AM   #289
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Why thank you two for the information. How is this connected to some of the other animated movies I'm seeing, like Darkseid vs. Trigon, and Superman kills Captain Marvel? Are they all animated spin-offs from the Injustice Universe?

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*raises hand* Resident (relatively new) DCAU expert here.
Perhaps you can answer a question I have then. Why is Batman a jerk while wearing The New Batman Adventures costume?

I've watched almost all of TAS, Beyond and Justice League, but very little of TNBA, but in that series he's mean. He acts like old Bruce for no reason.
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Old 12-20-2020, 05:10 PM   #290
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Why thank you two for the information. How is this connected to some of the other animated movies I'm seeing, like Darkseid vs. Trigon, and Superman kills Captain Marvel? Are they all animated spin-offs from the Injustice Universe?
I'm not particularly up to date on the current era of animated DC films, but afaik the only ones that could potentially be considered part of the original DCAU/Timmverse is Batman & Harley Quinn (which I personally refuse to believe is connected in any way -.-), and Justice League vs. the Fatal Five. As far as Injustice goes I'm not sure if any are directly related to the franchise.

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Perhaps you can answer a question I have then. Why is Batman a jerk while wearing The New Batman Adventures costume?

I've watched almost all of TAS, Beyond and Justice League, but very little of TNBA, but in that series he's mean. He acts like old Bruce for no reason.
Bruh I'd like to know too. OTL I've seen all of TNBA and a smattering of the early BTAS seasons, and I agree Bruce was much softer and kinder in the beginning. The "Old Wounds" ep even goes into a flashback that reveals the reason Dick Grayson quit being Robin was due to Batman's increasing violent tendencies and seeming lack of empathy for criminals they were chasing. =/ My best guess is Bruce simply got more jaded over time with how rarely his efforts at rehabilitating villains seemed to work (see: Harley Quinn continually returning to the Joker despite episodes such as "Harley's Holiday" showing potential for redemption).

But - this is why I highly recommend reading the "Gotham Adventures" tie-in comics (over the animated series), since they shed a lot more light on Bruce's behavior and relationships with others, and overall feature the entire Batfam working together in tandem. Even Dick is on much better terms with him there - not to mention has a far greater presence as Nightwing compared to his relatively little screentime in the show. (Incidentally the "Lost Years" comics also expand on the "Old Wounds" flashback and his transition to Nightwing, wherein it's clearer Dick isn't quite as bitter at Bruce and his tenure as Robin as the show would have one believe.) There are quite a few heartwarming issues where Bruce goes out of his way to help civilians and criminals alike, regardless of whether his actions are realized or not. It's just really good representation of the Batfam at its best, with a number of solid overarching stories and consistent character development. It's a shame they weren't adapted into the animated series itself, honestly folks who only watched the show are truly missing out on some gems. <3
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Old 12-21-2020, 09:25 AM   #291
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DCAU is not Injustice. You're referring to the film Justice League Dark: Apokolips War, which has Darkseid conquered Earth. The last heroes attack Apokolips and in desperation, Raven and Constantine release Trigon (trapped in a prison in Raven's body or soul or something). Trigon has a rivalry with Darkseid so they start fighting. It's the DCAU version of a kaiju battle. Then Flash runs away and does another Flashpoint, which was the start of the current DCAU.
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Old 12-31-2020, 12:20 AM   #292
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Bruh I'd like to know too. OTL I've seen all of TNBA and a smattering of the early BTAS seasons, and I agree Bruce was much softer and kinder in the beginning. The "Old Wounds" ep even goes into a flashback that reveals the reason Dick Grayson quit being Robin was due to Batman's increasing violent tendencies and seeming lack of empathy for criminals they were chasing. =/ My best guess is Bruce simply got more jaded over time with how rarely his efforts at rehabilitating villains seemed to work (see: Harley Quinn continually returning to the Joker despite episodes such as "Harley's Holiday" showing potential for redemption).
Here's my theory, then. In EP04 of TNBA Batman gets gassed by Scarecrow's "no fear" toxin that removes all his inhibitions, leading him to be more violent and scary.

My wager is he'd been under the effects of that gas for the entire run of TNBA and it sort of wore off by Justice League.
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Old 12-31-2020, 04:53 PM   #293
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Here's my theory, then. In EP04 of TNBA Batman gets gassed by Scarecrow's "no fear" toxin that removes all his inhibitions, leading him to be more violent and scary.

My wager is he'd been under the effects of that gas for the entire run of TNBA and it sort of wore off by Justice League.
Hm, interesting theory. That doesn't really explain why he started being a dick when Dick was still Robin though... *shrug*
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Old 12-31-2020, 05:40 PM   #294
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I've rewatched that "World's Finest" clip many times because I've been studying the animation, but only just now did it click that the reason Batman gave Superman the kryptonite shard was...to prevent Superman from pursuing him as he made an escape.
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Old 02-27-2021, 02:56 AM   #295
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Is anyone watching Wandavision? What do you think of it?
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