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Old 07-25-2007, 11:01 AM   #1
Sylar
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Liek, rate mah teamz

Yeah, so I've never really took any notice of natures, what moves are good, and EV-spreads, but this gen I am, so I need help. Only got 5 of the 6, dunno what to have as my 6th, any suggestions about any aspects are welcome, since I'm a complete newb at this.

Ninetales @ ???
Flash Fire
Modest (+Sp. Atk, -Atk)
-Flamethrower
-Will-O-Wisp/Hypnosis
-Dark Pulse/Nasty Plot
-Energy Ball

Only in the team because I like Ninetales xd

Rhyperior @ ???
Solid Rock
Adamant (+Atk, -Sp. Atk)
-Avalanche
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Curse/???

...mmyes.

Tyranitar @ ???
Sandstream
??? (+, -)
-???
-???
-???
-???

Need sandstream for Rhyperior defense boost, so I didn't bother thinking up a set xd

Torterra @ ???
Overgrow
Impish (+Def, -Sp.Atk)
-Earthquake
-Stealth Rock
-Leech Seed
-Wood Hammer

Ooh eee, ooh aah aah, ting tang, walla walla bing bang.

Poliwrath @ Iron Ball
Damp
Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
-Brick Break
-Waterfall
-Swords Dance
-Fling

Couldn't think of a fourth move or item, so I just chucked in Fling and Iron Ball xd
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Old 07-25-2007, 03:03 PM   #2
Talon87
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Imo, Flash Fire is an ability which can be put to great use alongside a grass-type using Sunny Day. It is no different than the popular trend amongst Electivire users to send out a Gyarados first who uses his turn to set up a Dragon Dance. If the foe is likely to TBolt, you switch out for Electivire and kick ass. If the foe is not likely to TBolt, you got a free setup on an Att demigod.

The difference here, imo, is much more significant. Sunny Day will not only likely lure out a fire-type attack from your enemies, it will also double the power of fire-based moves. So not only will Ninetales switch into a blazing Flamethrower and receive no damage, but she will be (fully) prepared to use her own fire attacks at twice her normal power. Nothing to scoff at, particularly not if she is holding Choice Specs (1.5x) or Charcoal (1.2x). Let us assume Charcoal, for sake of argument ...

Normal Flamethrower on Ninetales = 95 base power x 1.5 STAB = 142.5
Sunny Day'ed Flamethrower on Ninetales = 95 base power x 1.5 STAB x 2.0 Sunny Day = 285
Sunny Day'ed Flamethrower on Ninetales holding Charcoal = 95 x 1.5 x 2.0 x 1.2 = 342
Sunny Day'ed Flamethrower on Ninetales holding Charcoal and having been hit by a fire attack = 342 x ??? (I forget and can't find it right now; I think it's 1.5x, but I could be wrong)

In short, if the foe does not IMMEDIATELY neutralize the threat, he will be facing a raging inferno from a beautiful witch who sports a base SpAtt of 81 and a base Special Defense and Speed of 100 each. 342 base damage (after factoring in the power-ups and NOT factoring in Flash Fire itself) is quite a bit sexier than Self Destruct. And you get to use it for another turn so long as the fox isn't dead yet.

For these reasons, I ...
a) applaud your use of Ninetales, in spite of what others may say (voting for Bellyzard, Arcanine, Blaziken, or Infernape)
b) insist that you set her up with a grass-type who can make very good use of Sunny Day
c) give that grassie the Heat Rock to hold

It is important that your grass-type be more than a pretty face preceding Ninetales because you will not be switching until you're certain they plan to hit you with fire. This means that your grassie will be staying in the ring for at least ONE TURN (if not more) after she uses Sunny Day. If you pre-emptively switch to Ninetales too soon, the entire plan is ruined -- it will be too predictable, no fire attack will have yet been launched, etc. etc.

Finally, Ninetales is what I think of as "a good attempt at cleaning up a team" ; she is by no means meant to lead the assault. Tyranitar, Groudon, Kyogre, and other "weather is my ability" Pokemon shut down this strategy easily, so they will have to be eliminated before the grass-type can set this plan up. Similarly, you will have to watch out for Pokemon that force Ninetales to switch after just one attack (e.g. a fire-type who knows Earthquake).
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Old 07-25-2007, 03:15 PM   #3
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Example of the ideal strategy (and tips for non-Ninetales users to watch out for) ...

... Bruce's Gyarados fainted Talon's Raichu!
Talon sends out Jumpluff!

Turn 1a: Jumpluff uses Sunny Day!
Turn 1b: Gyarados uses Return!

Before Turn 2: Bruce switches out Gyarados for Infernape
Turn 2a: Jumpluff uses Sleep Powder! It misses!
Turn 2b: Here's Infernape! :O

Before Turn 3: Talon switches out Jumpluff for Ninetales
Turn 3a: Infernape uses Flamethrower! ...... but oh noes!
Turn 3b: Because it hits Ninetales, not Jumpluff! :O Ninetales' Flash Fire activates!

As you can see here, this is the junction. This is the turn which determines who wins and who loses. If Bruce has any Pokemon to defeat Ninetales (Tyranitar, fire Pokemon with high attack and Earthquake, etc. etc.), now is the time to switch out to them. If he does not, he's sunk. Completely, royally sunk. There are still five turns left of Sunny Day. If he can't turn it off, chances are, he's going to lose two Pokemon before he's able to KO the Ninetales. 2-for-1 is a good deal, and depending on how shitty of a trainer he is, you can expect much better results than this.
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Old 07-25-2007, 03:19 PM   #4
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Finally ... conflicting weather is never a good idea. Tyranitar is a gorgeous Pokemon -- his Sandstream helps kill so many things believe it or not, and it now affords him a very amazing SpDef boost. He has a fantastic attack stat and a great move pool to choose from, including STAB on Stone Edge and Crunch. Still ... his ability is a one-way ticket to shutting down Sunny Day, so ...................

There are many teams these days which try to run "Sandstorm-friendly lineups." This is (a) to avoid any detriment that may come from the enemy using it, and (b) to make it so that everybody enjoys the SpDef bonus. It is advisable to have Metagross and Skarmory on a team with Tyranitar (imo, maybe not in others'), so you might want to consider this option if you insist on keeping Tyranitar over Ninetales + a Grassie.
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Old 07-25-2007, 05:59 PM   #5
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Ninetales @ ???
Flash Fire
Modest (+Sp. Atk, -Atk)
-Flamethrower
-Will-O-Wisp/Hypnosis
-Dark Pulse/Nasty Plot
-Energy Ball
Calm is technically better since Ninetales does decently well as a UU Special Defense Wall. Sadly, that's in UU, not so much in OU. In OU, I would never suggest anything aside from double-status, namely using BOTH Hypnosis and Will-O-Wisp. Without both, you'll likely get screwed to any powerful physical attackers. Energy Ball is interesting when used on a Fire Type, as it easily covers Rock, Ground, and Water, it's main weaknesses. Sadly, it doesn't cover Pokemon who are resistant and using Rock, Ground, or Water moves. This is probably where double-status comes in. If you plan to use this for the tournament, think about using Timid and maxing out speed and Special Defense or something. It's not easy since Ninetales is pretty much UU. If you don't care, go for max HP and SPDEF with Calm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Rhyperior @ ???
Solid Rock
Adamant (+Atk, -Sp. Atk)
-Avalanche
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Curse/???
Swords Dance > Curse on this monster. But this moveset isn't particularly my favorite. I personally like using Choice Band with Stone Edge over a pumping move. Rhyperior really can't afford to waste a turn pumping itself. It really needs to just go out, do it's damage, then leave before something double-super hits it. It would be okay for pumping if you had Sandstreaming TTar or Hippo[dude].

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Tyranitar @ ???
Sandstream
??? (+, -)
-???
-???
-???
-???
Depends what role needs filling. Tyraniboah can do special attacking while not having any problems with Empoleon or Blissey. Or you can give him DD/Rock Polish for offensive sweeping. Or you can make him do nothing.

Tyraniboah
|Sandstream|Quiet|Leftovers|
-Substitute
-Focus Punch
-Thunderbolt
-Dark Pulse

You require perfect 31 IV HP and max EVs into HP. This will give you 404 HP and 101 HP Subs, which will block L100 Siesmic Toss. Which means you can get quite a few Focus Punches through shy of your opponent doing Double Kick. T-bolt and Dark Pulse are for DEF walls who think they can block you.

Tyranisweeper
|Sandstream|Adamant|Life Orb/Leftovers|
-Dragon Dance/Rock Polish
-Earthquake
-Rock Slide/Stone Edge
-Crunch/Pursuit

Life Orb will work better with Rock Polish because of the loss of ATK boosts that DD give. Leftovers works better with DD cuz you will typically need 2 to get sweeping. You will want 207 Speed to outrace Suicune who might try to Roar you away or hit you. Anyway, after 2 DDs or 1 RP, you outrace everything, so just use the appropriate move to attack. If you don't have a SE move, I suggest using something with STAB.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Torterra @ ???
Overgrow
Impish (+Def, -Sp.Atk)
-Earthquake
-Stealth Rock
-Leech Seed
-Wood Hammer
Sadly I think Torterra might go UU. It's typing is decent, but the double ice weakness, low speed, low special defense and inability to deal with most of those things basically means it's Icebeam's #1 target (next to Salamence, Garchomp, and some other double-ice weak dudes). And without a Rock Typing, you don't get the benefit of SPDEF boosting from Sandstream.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Poliwrath @ Iron Ball
Damp
Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
-Brick Break
-Waterfall
-Swords Dance
-Fling
Water Absorb >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Damp
The most common moveset is:
Poliwrath
|Water Absorb|Adamant|Leftovers|
-Focus Punch
-Waterfall
-Hypnosis
-Icepunch/Stone Edge?/Rock Slide?/Substitute/Filler

Switch it in on a Pokemon you suspect will be using Surf. You're given free healing if they're stuck with a Choice Specs, you're free to do Focus Punch. Otherwise, Hypnosis whoever it is and let loose a Focus Punch. Super hoses Suicune who only use Surf, which was an old standard that some never bothered to change in their Pokemon.

Your team overall lacks any real sweeping. TTar can sort of fill it, but people without experience using TTar properly cannot really take full advantage of the DD set or RP set. And Tyraniboah is also difficult to use without prior knowledge or experience. Your team also shares a common EQ weakness among three of your Pokemon. Consider using a Levitater or Flyer. Gengar might be a good choice, but Sandstream can be a problem for most. Gengar is also a good choice because you lack a Special Sweeper. You also lack a real DEF Wall. Ninetales is sorta a SPDEF Wall, so I won't criticize it.
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Old 08-14-2007, 07:02 AM   #6
Sylar
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Ninetales @ ???
Flash Fire
Modest (+Sp. Atk, -Atk)
-Flamethrower
-Will-O-Wisp/Hypnosis
-Dark Pulse/Nasty Plot
-Energy Ball
Kay, I've decided to go different to this now. Well, I've gone different from my entire team, but still. xD Ninetales is now this:

Ninetales @ Charcoal
Flash Fire
Timid (+Spd, -Atk)
-Flamethrower
-Energy Ball
-Extrasensory
-Will-O-Wisp

I'm just wondering, should I get Nasty Plot on instead to go for the kill, or get in a quick burn on the opposition? With both it's speed and sp. def really high, I could probably get a Nasty Plot in, survive, and then use a move accordingly, but I kinda want to keep Will-O-Wisp for some reason. xd

So, in other words, I've completely ignored everything in this thread. :P Sorry 'bout that. But this isn't the Ninetales for the DP tournament, so meh. xD
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Old 08-14-2007, 02:49 PM   #7
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Extrasensory is almost useless on a Ninetales. Psychic only covers Fighting and Poison, neither of which are a major problem to Ninetales. Hypnosis is very important, as it essentially puts any counters to sleep. Meanwhile, Extrasensory is something that will likely not KO much. Technically, Fire Blast is stronger on Ninetales then a Super Effective Extrasensory is, except to Croagunk and Toxicroak (which are weak to Fire due to one of their abilities iirc).

As for Nasty Plot, it's sadly not workable for Ninetales. Even if you can pull one off, Ninetales isn't nearly as fast or as sturdy as it needs to be to use it properly. If it were Calm Mind, it would be a bit better (but only a bit). Ninetales just can't take many hits with it's array of weaknesses and lack of a resistances.

Charcoal is also useless. I mean... Completely useless. Leftovers is much more important, but if you don't want to or can't use it (like Item Clause or something), use Wide Lens for higher accuracy for Hypnosis and Will-O-Wisp. Additionally, if you opt for Fire Blast, it helps that too!
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Old 08-14-2007, 07:24 PM   #8
Jerichi
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Re: Liek, rate mah teamz

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylar
Poliwrath @ Iron Ball
Damp
Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
-Brick Break
-Waterfall
-Swords Dance
-Fling

Couldn't think of a fourth move or item, so I just chucked in Fling and Iron Ball xd
Hypnosis + Lefties or Shell Bell if no Lefties are possible > Fling. Unless you can think of something better.
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