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Old 10-08-2014, 12:13 PM   #1
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You're all LO-sers in my mind

As I'm sure you're all aware, Kush recently stepped down as an LO. I'm only half around mostly out of a lack of much better to do whilst I job and flat hunt. Dave, Jeri and SS aren't getting any younger.

We're starting to consider who the LO's of the future might be. We have some ideas, but thought we'd open suggestions to the general community. Please do not nominate yourself. The point of this thread is to see whose opinions the community generally value and looks up to. Nominating yourselves doesn't tell us anything. Also, this is not a straight vote. We just want to see what general opinion is of the people we've already thought of, and whether there are people we've glossed over. Nominate as many or as few names as you like.

This isn't a "we're going to have new LO's within the fortnight" thing. Just making sure we have options.
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:20 PM   #2
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To be honest, the two people at this point I would.nominate are Charm and Haymez. Of course with Haymez gone that leaves Charm. I personally feel that Charm is a good battler and has the skills to be a LO, of course he's not community active so that's a problem. I can nominate people who are really active and have good (Cibbir, Blaze, etc.), but I know they don't have the skills a LO needs just quite yet. So, atm , there are some people close, bit exactly all there, but if Charm was more community active he'd most likely be a shoe in for me.

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Old 10-08-2014, 12:24 PM   #3
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Thinking over the various members we have, its been difficult. We don't have a lot of active experienced members since most have disappeared and flew away on the wings of life. So honestly, other than myself, the only person I can think that it fit for the job is Sneezey. He has pretty good activity, generally gets things done, has a good amount of insight on the league and how it works. But he's a dick. He also pretty good with offering input and criticism when need be.

Other than him...I don't honestly know else to choose. Charm and Deebs are good Gym Leaders but I don't at the moment see either of them as an LO. Connor /might/ be able to do it but I don't know if he has even been in the League for a year yet. I just don't know if he has the experience. Kairne is pretty cool and would have been my second suggestion but his activity can be spotty (no offense meant).

Also Dave for LO please.
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:25 PM   #4
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I nominate Connor. SS and Jeri cover signatures very well. Connor can fill the role to help Dave in referee matters. From what I have seen, Connor offers an insightful answer almost 90% of the time. If he is wrong, he is willing to find the answer for you and respond in a timely manner. He is benevolent and has great relations with the community. He inspires leadership and according to his birthday on UPN, he seems to be young enough to offer longevity.
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:25 PM   #5
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Seconding the Charm notion. He's been around long enough to have a solid grasp of the ins and outs of certain things, he'd just need a tad bit more refinement. Both as a battler, community member and ultimately as a person I'd say he has the requisites.

Deebs is someone else I would probably seriously consider as a nominee should his activity stabilise. He's definitely been around long enough and has the general know how, he just needs to get back up to speed on a few things.
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:26 PM   #6
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Old 10-08-2014, 12:41 PM   #7
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Sneezey has already been offering his services in various parts of the league for ages, planting the "LO" name just seems like the next logical step.
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Old 10-08-2014, 01:27 PM   #8
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I honestly don't know if we have anyone of LO caliber material at this time in the league other than Sneezey who has stated various times that he doesn't really care. Charm does seem to generally know what's up but I don't think I know enough about him to make a definitive call on that yet, plus if I'm correct he has some issues staying active for long periods of time. This leaves Connor as someone else who knows what they're doing in the league and has shown Dave-like progress in becoming a higher TL within a year of being in the ASB and reffing a lot of matches with good frequency that have some quality in them, which implies that he could be good on ref apps. My issue with Connor as an LO is that he hasn't really been around long enough for me to think of him as someone who really knows the ins and outs of the league enough so that I could take a ruling he makes seriously without someone else backing him up. Like, I generally trust his judgement, but I feel like he doesn't quite have the experience to make a good LO at this time. After those three there are a few other people who also have the potential to be LOed but in my opinion shouldn't because of various issues that I'm too lazy to go into right here..

Overall, if I were to pick one person to nominate for LO I'd pick Sneezey, because he's already been doing a lot of work that would normally be done by LOs like helping to rewrite the ghost rules and I believe he also helped a bit with the recent SC rewrites. He's also got the experience and ability to make smart decisions about league policy and rule on general policy questions and such.

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Last edited by deh74; 10-08-2014 at 01:43 PM.
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Old 10-08-2014, 01:32 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by deh74 View Post
I honestly don't know if we have anyone of LO caliber material at this time in the league other than Sneezey who has stated various times that he doesn't want to be an LO.
Woah now, don't misquote me. My exact feelings on the matter are now and have always been "I don't really care, it's a golden name and the ability to post in S&I, and everything else is exported anyway."

That said and moving swiftly along, I honestly am not really sure who would make good material for the position. If I had to pick names, I'd have to go with either Charminions or Connor. Charm because he's been around quite some time and knows most things like the back of his hand, and Connor because he has a stellar rep with pretty much everyone, with the downsides making me generally unsure actually being that each lacks the major quality the other one has to some degree, Charm due to not socializing all that much so no newbie even recognizes who he bloody is even though he's a GL, and Connor due to while picking things up at an incredible rate still being a bit lacking in some areas.
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Old 10-08-2014, 01:42 PM   #10
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I thought I said "don't quote me on this though" after that... Odd.

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Old 10-08-2014, 01:57 PM   #11
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I nominate Sneezey. Connor would be good for ref apps, but Sneezey is good overall.

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Old 10-08-2014, 01:59 PM   #12
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Charm, Cibbir, Sneeze. All of which have their talents and time to offer to the league en masse.
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Old 10-08-2014, 02:10 PM   #13
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So, to lead off, I think what an LO needs is:
1) Experience with how the PASBL works
2) A vision of what they want the PASBL to move towards
3) At least two fingers on the pulse of the PASBL (meaning they should already be actively reading the public opinion and be providing suggestions and other LO-y things)
4) The willingness to speedily set things in motion when necessary (more activity than anything else).
The first two points are more about having an LO who knows what they're doing, and the latter two are to make sure they actually do it (there's no point in giving power to someone who isn't going to use it- And that's really all LOdom is; It's not some fancy title of "this person is good", it's more like being an evolved Ref, providing a supporting role to the entire league).

So, that said, the two people I would think to make good LOs are Sneezey and Kairne! They're both pretty much the embodiment of point three, so much so that anyone who's been around for a week probably knows their names. They've been around for more than long enough for Point 1, both partaking in many a battle (and Sneezey being pretty much the most veteran active member we have). They've both been known to actively push for change when they feel it's needed, showing them in pretty handily for Point 4, and they both have hilariously easy to see internal compasses (Point 2). Sneezebag is slightly more towards the conservative side (PASBL-wise), Kairne is slightly more towards the liberal side (PASBL-wise), Sneezey is slightly more inclined towards balance, Kairne is slightly more inclined towards lore and freedom... They're both very different people, but I think they'd both make really good LOs.

Right, and before I forget again, Cibbir gets an honourable mention for being an upright, helpful and relatively modest asset to the PASBL already. That said, he's still learning the ins and outs of the PASBL. I think once he's been around a bit longer and got a firm grasp on where the PASBL is as a full system, he'll start to have ideas about where its not and where he wants it to go, and I think that's when he'll make an excellent LO. I see a lot of similarities between his development and that of the Britpack, but he's only just now gotten to the stage where he's starting to find and manipulate the loopholes. I'm certain he'll be the perfectly balanced man for the job if we give him some more time to ripen (or whatever the verb for flower->fruit is).
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Old 10-08-2014, 02:42 PM   #14
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I'll definitely weigh on for Sneeze. He does a lot of stuff in a semi-official capacity already, and has seen a lot of changes in ASB in his many, many years. He's smart, although sometimes a little old-fashioned. Which is easy enough to counterplay, since he does usually try to listen to those newer when they have good points.

However, I've been having the idea pop back and forth of, instead of instating LOs with full power like we have had a lot, presenting the idea of Junior LOs. Basically, folks who are higher than regular members, but not quite full to the LO calibre. They would do things like help in S&I for some of the simpler things, do some of the more simple things like Hidden Power approvals, and receive training to do the more significant LO duties, such as squads or having a hand in the reffing school, down the line, while helping with things like move rewrites and specschars alongside the full LOs and the membership. This gives a halfway step between normal members and full LOs, and gives both the regular members and any new junior LOs something to shoot for, and overall I think would be a positive step.

Now, if this suggestion is looked at, I would recommend Blaze and Kin for this position.

I am constantly surprised at just how much Blaze has grown. He has his quirks, and he definitely has some quirky Pokemon preferences, but that's not bad. He thinks about things in a bit of a different way than others, and he has been here a couple few years, seen a fair bit of change. He has a lot of growth potential, and he's young.

Then there's Seth. Kin is one of the weirdest souls we have here, and his way of thinking is quite different from most, but that gives him a more unique viewpoint. I think that Kin personally has a lot he could help do when he weighs in with an opinion different than anyone else would have thought of, if he has the power where people will at least listen and give it a token consideration. He's also almost unshakably nice, which is a huge thing for community reachout. He has also been around a hell of a long time and has seen a lot of shift in his time.

So that's my US $0.02
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As may be expected though, our clear winner here was Kairne, ASB's champion of prioritizing the pokemon you like over those that are objectively better. I mean, one of his mains is a Watchog.
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Old 10-08-2014, 02:45 PM   #15
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Connor is arguably the best none LO ref and is generally knowledgeable league wise. People skill wise he's pretty good and remains pretty even headed and kind to people so I nominate him.

I'd also nominate Sneezey for just being generally knowledgeable and besides he helps around enough as it is that it actually surprises me he isn't an LO already.
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Old 10-08-2014, 02:52 PM   #16
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There is currently no-one suitable to be taken on as a full LO.

I've said before that we need junior people. Farm out responsibility and small degrees of powers to some people and see how they take it. Have a sigs team. Have an arenas team. Have a website team. Have someone do ref of the month, have a rota for HP and item approvals, have a rota and an internal system for doing S/I and actually enforce it so that you don't get one person giving answers that turn out to cause multiple problems. Have literally everyone do ref approvals because the current system is completely unacceptable.

Hire about three people like Connor, Charm and Deebs. Give them limited powers and responsibilities. Kuno is terrible at permissions but I imagine it's possible to do this. On Serebii just get them limited edit powers in whatever areas are needed.

Also, you need someone with balls. We currently lack this quality in our leadership.

Last edited by Mercutio; 10-08-2014 at 03:03 PM.
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Old 10-08-2014, 04:07 PM   #17
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I completely agree with Kush. Feels dirty to say it (though his sexy as fuck Samantha Barks avatar makes it feel so much better), but he's right. Outsourcing some of the smaller areas would be an excellent decision, and would quickly improve the speed and efficiency of the league. I can't say there's any one user I would consider to have all the desirable qualities in an LO, but for "trainee LOs", I would nominate Sneezey, Deebs (if his activity stabilises) and Connor.
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Old 10-08-2014, 04:31 PM   #18
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It should probably be reinforced that any LO (or GL) who doesn't actively post in both TOs and also contribute to the community all the time probably should think about stepping down and shouldn't be promoted.
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Old 10-08-2014, 08:47 PM   #19
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Come on guys, no one nominating me?

I kid I'm horrible.

In all seriousness, though, I nominate Kairne and Sneezey. Both of them have been in the league for quite some time now, and generally have balanced and fair input regarding many of the changes to ASB that we are currently experiencing. Sneezey is a very capable ref, as is Kairne, although due to Kairne's spotty-ish activity not many people get to see that. Both have also helped me a tremendous amount with sigs, battling techniques, etc. and their expertise and advice would be a valuable boon to many other new battlers.

Honorable mentions go to Blaze, Charm, and Kin, with Cibbir also there but slightly behind them due to only being here for just over a year.

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Old 10-08-2014, 10:18 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Charminions View Post
Sneezey has already been offering his services in various parts of the league for ages, planting the "LO" name just seems like the next logical step.
I echo the sentiments of my boss. Sneazey is an excellent choice. He clearly cares about the league and has been around since the Bronze Age, when people used to use wool as tampons. Kairne is also a good choice due to his level of experience and passion.

I'm hesitant to nominate Connor now, even though he's a good chap, mainly because he's still young and there are other candidates who have more experience than him. Maybe not now.

Charm also should be considered because he stays out of drama, gets shit done, and knows his stuff. But my main nomination is Sneazebag. Make it official please. ^___^

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Old 10-09-2014, 12:37 AM   #21
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Man does time fly. Proud of Sneezey and my fellow Char(m) for getting all these nominations.

From the past and lurking, I would agree with Kush's statement that current nominees should be given limited powers/responsibilities vs. full LO.

I would only be able to confidently nominate Sneezey based on what I've seen and know.
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Old 10-09-2014, 03:01 AM   #22
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I think Sneezey should definitely be LO. Like he's already doing LO-ish jobs anyways so yeah.

Though personally I think Kush's suggestion is the best - to have junior LOs that is between a full LO and a normal member and divide them into different departments or something. I think that the current LOs could definitely use some extra hands with their jobs, because piling a crapton of sigs or huge amount of Ref Apps/Ref Tests onto a single LO is just making life hard for them. Having Junior LOs also puts them onto a path of LO-hood. The current LOs are going to put down their LO jobs one day, and someone will have to take their torch and continue. Instead of finding a replacement out of a pool of trainers and then teaching them the ropes of LO stuff, why not just promote a already experienced Junior LO into a full-fledged LO. I mean most LO nominees are experienced enough to not but who knows what will happen in the future? Having Junior LOs act as an insurance after the current LO-in-charge leaves, and when they do so, they can just pick up the torch and RUUUUUUN. I think this is a pretty good safeguard against the fact that people are ageing and aren't getting any less busier.

There's definitely a lot of grammatical mistakes and awkward structuring in that but screw that my exams are over. And it feels weird as a newbie to type this out but YEAH WHO CARES MIRITE.

What what do you mean I'm promoting this idea so I can become a Junior LO in an eternity's worth of time and then a LO in another eternity's worth of time and then get power. S-Shut up, Baka!
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Old 10-09-2014, 03:37 AM   #23
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We need someone most people trust about ASB things, someone with the balls to call out people for being idiots, but most importantly, someone who gives a fuck. This means Sneezey, Kin, and Connor(though he could use some more experience.)

I can't say I'm a big fan of the junior LOs thing, mostly because I think you either trust someone to be right or you don't.
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Old 10-09-2014, 10:19 AM   #24
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My votes go to Connor, Sneezey, and Charminions as well. All of them are good for stuff and I think Connor would be excellent for referee matters. Sneezey is good overall, and Charminions too but activity is something to consider.
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Old 10-09-2014, 08:12 PM   #25
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Might as well chuck a pair if pennies in here.

Honestly the only person I can and woukd like to see as an LO is Sneezey. Dude's been around for god knows how long and is pretty much included on the same level as all the current LOs are. He knows a lot of shit and is active as much as the next guy so might as well give him that gold name and actual authority rather than authority granted by his being Sneezey.

As for the other peopme being nommed, I'm in the camp that they're all missing out on just one thing that keeps them back. Deebs' activity is just a bit tok inconsistent lately, which is an issue that plagues Kairne as well. Charm has the previously mentioned issue of not quite being active enough outside of battles. All Connor really needs is to be around a little longer both for experience reasons and, while his activity level has been superb, to make sure that the S.S. Active doesn't suddenly sink like has happened to people in the past.

Yeah. I'm not good at shit like this but that's my thoughts.
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