08-06-2007, 07:40 PM | #101 | |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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08-06-2007, 08:00 PM | #102 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
I just finished Day 1 with Takeshi. I'm trying to hit up Tsugumi while being as nice to Sora as possible. Sort of like how I did with Yuu and Sara on Kid's file. (I was always nice to Sara unless it was a Yuu vs. Sara scenario.) I'm hoping that this will give me the option of going back and replaying from Day (e.g.) 4 or 5 and get a Good End with Sora if it turns out that my decision to run with Tsugumi winds me up with a Bad End.
So ... spoiler thoughts! If using Mozilla Firefox, hold down the Ctrl button and then use your wheel on your mouse to make the small text legible. (About 5-6 scrolls should do it.) Otherwise, quote to read. Each section will be labeled "A", "B", "C", etc., so if you can't get size formatting to work within quote boxes for some reason, you can simply say, "With regards to Letter A ..."
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08-06-2007, 08:10 PM | #103 | |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Talon, your speculative ventures have lead me to dig up a diamond when I was looking for gold. I'm off to the academy to flaunt my findings to my flabbergasted fellows!
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08-07-2007, 02:06 AM | #104 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Well, I am on day two of Takeshi's route while trying to go for Sora. However, I am having such a difficult time doing anything mean to Tsugumi. Like when they asked me if I should either look for Sora or fix the generator with Tsugumi, I chose to repair the generator with Tsugumi, because I already know that looking for Sora is pointless (I believe that knowledge isn't something I should've used in this case). I have to say, Tsugumi is the shiznit. I will so go for her next time if I didn't accidentally stray on her path already (if so, I will backtrack because I already made decisions that went right for Sora, meaning that Tsugumi's path will be phailure) ><.
There is another thing about this that is really strange. Tsugumi gets along really well with Coco =O. I don't know if there's any meaning in that, but I thought Tsugumi would hate Coco. I guess it's an "opposites attract" thing. |
08-07-2007, 02:36 AM | #105 | |||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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This is an interesting turn of events, though. Talon is gunning for Tsugumi, BBB Sora, both on Takeshi's Path. And both look to end up at the same point. Quote:
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08-07-2007, 09:50 AM | #106 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
I've noticed that (if we call Kid's path "the base path" and Takeshi's path the deviant path, okay?) the people on Takeshi's path aren't 1:1 correspondence-ly matching up with people from Kid's path ... it's more of a mix. Examples ...
- the Sara from Kid's path has been absorbed into (in order of significance) (1) Coco, (2) Tsugumi, (3) Kid. For instance, Coco is the person who has totally replaced Sara; she's also the person who invents the nickname "Nakkyu" for Yuu. Tsugumi is the one who holds the deep, PC-genius conversation with Sora on Takeshi's path, and half of her facial expressions remind me of Sara's. And then as for Kid, he says "Nin! Nin!" during the Kick the Can event on Day 2. As we all know, "Nin! Nin!" was one of Sara's signature expressions on the Kid path. - the Yuu on Takeshi's path seems to be a mix between Kid's Yuu and someone else, not entirely sure who - Coco is largely "the replacement for Sara," but she has said many things so far which the Kid originally said on Kid's path. For instance, she's the one who says to Sora, "Let me get this straight ... you're saying that at best, we'll be gone by 4:40pm on May 7th. But the reverse also holds true! At the worst, we still have until 4:40pm on May 6th!" - Tsugumi can't only be "part herself, part Sara" because of the important fact that she was the one on Takeshi's path who knew that the door would be hot. Since only Tsugumi and Takeshi were there, and since Kid (on Kid's path) has this premonition that he's seen this before and knows the door is scalding hot, this suggests that Tsugumi is "part Kid" and the Kid's-route Kid is "part Tsugumi." I don't yet know to what extent this is simply the writers recasting lines to maintain character balance and to what extent this is the writers suggesting that the personalities have been split and rearranged between the two different dimensions. All I do know is, I'm observing a lot of people on Takeshi's path saying things or doing things that were done by other characters on Kid's path ... other characters who (in all cases but Coco/Sara) exist equally on both paths.
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08-07-2007, 11:36 AM | #107 | |||||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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You bring up something interesting regarding Kid, and no doubt he and Coco will do more stuff like that later on. Quote:
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08-07-2007, 12:38 PM | #108 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Alrightey. I am on day three of Takeshi's path and going for Sora. Ok, something is crazy wrong about Kid. When he was counting, another one appeared right in front of us, completely oblivious to the game. I don't know what exactly is wrong, but I am taken aback by it. I won't make any stupid speculations about this, because I don't really know enough to make one. It probably has something to do with Sara because I remember something he said. He said "Nin! Nin! Ninja!"
Also, when I found Sora, I just had to smile at her. I found it very charming at how she was hiding behind the counter like that, and then acting like an employee in an attempt to fool me. |
08-07-2007, 12:49 PM | #109 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Just reached the Takeshi start of Day 4. Use your mouse wheel (in Mozilla Firefox) to make the text below legible. 5-6 scrolls oughta do it.
I chose to tighten the two valves in the Clockwise direction both times. I have not gone back and tried the other three permutations to see if they result in a different path. Frankly, I'm sort of happy with the result I obtained -- Tsugumi being mortally wounded -- because it gave Takeshi the opportunity to play hero and save Tsugumi's life. Also, because she is healing radically quickly, it's revealing that Tsugumi is not all that she appears to be. Because she did have a fractured femur and arteries requiring sutures, we can rule out that Tsugumi is a robot. Cyborg, maybe, but not a robot. I would say it's much more likely at this point that she is a "super soldier," like the kind we see in so many sci-fi stories, the military projects who have been genetically engineered to be superior to the human race in every sense of the word. Doppel does tell me, "Talon, Sara is smarter than Tsugumi," but still, the girl is clearly intelligent (unlike Kid's-path Takeshi) and she's also super strong. When Sora asked me, "I have a secret to tell you. Will you come with me?" I chose Yes rather than No, because Yuu had just got done telling me that Tsugumi would not be awake for the next few days. I hope that that decision won't put me on the Bad End path for Takeshi x Tsugumi. Sora seemed particularly flirtatious ... But hey! I did get a massive plot point out of it! Sora revealed for fact what I've already hypothesized -- that there are two LeMUs, a Y-branch where you make a decision and depending on which you make you either go to Timeline A or Timeline B. The Y-branch here would appear to be the LeMU sirens going off and deciding who one wishes to play as -- Takeshi or Kid. And of course there are countless other Y branches each and every time we are posed with a choice between two questions to ask or decisions to make. My save file on Day 4 still doesn't have anybody's name next to Takeshi's. Probably because I've been nice enough to Sora and Tsugumi and the game can't decide who to give me yet, or something. *shrug* Please Tsugumi. Even if it's a Bad End, I would like to try for a Tsugumi path. I'm torn now, though, between pursuing Takeshi x Sora or Kid x Sara next. I had said I would do Kid x Sara, and I think I will, but I must admit that Takeshi x Sora does look fun. Is there no way to do a Coco path until you've unlocked every other path, Doppel?
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08-07-2007, 02:19 PM | #110 | ||||||||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Just a note - I replayed the Bad End (Takeshi) and discovered something ENORMOUSLY important that isn't revealed in any other path outside of Coco! It's really hard to pick up, though - I MIGHT point it out to you guys if one of you heads down there but doing so might give something away. Suffice to say, it's worth your while to go on the Bad End anyway - it had enough of an effect on me that I was scared to death of Himmel and was enraged at Coco's 'spectre' in the last parts of You's Path. It also made You's Path more worth-while for me since I had to struggle for so long to escape the nightmare that was LeMU.
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I've no access to my game, but from your position in the story, I believe there are two very important keys you over-looked, which I'll point out depending on your ending. Quote:
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08-07-2007, 03:01 PM | #111 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Hmm. Two important keys I've overlooked? I dunno ... it may just be that I didn't think they were important enough to post about. Or that stuff I did think was important (like whether to turn the gas main Clockwise or Counterclockwise) was skipped over by you yourself in your reply. *shrug*
As an example of one possible "key" you may be thinking I missed but I simply didn't bother talking about, HOTDOGS. It's obvious that the two LeMUs are not simply "two divergent paths with their own unique space-time" but are rather "two divergent paths that occupy the same space" because of the issue of hotdogs and chicken sandwiches. On Takeshi's path ... - Takeshi finds hot dogs in the cooler, but there are only enough for one meal. He prepares them for early morning breakfast (at like 6am, way before the Kid-path team wakes up) and everybody eats his share of hotdogs until they're all gone. - Kid finds two sandwiches on the bench and Takeshi says "Oh, those must be the ones I placed there." But he's already forgetting that he only put ONE there. Well anyway, Kid gives away the two sandwiches: one to Tsugumi, and the other to I-forget. On Kid's path ... - Takeshi finds hot dogs in the cooler, but they don't get around to cooking breakfast until after the group on Takeshi's path, and so when Takeshi opens the cooler, the hot dogs are missing, and Takeshi accuses Tsugumi of theft. Then he sees a rat later and everybody assumes the rat got to them instead. - Kid finds two sandwiches on the bench and brings them back to the conference room. He gives one sandwich away, but as he reaches for the second ... it's gone. People accuse Kid of hallucinating, but he *knows* he had two sandwiches ... I mean, there's a lot of stuff I could talk about, but I don't want to because it's time I could spend playing the game, so I only write those things where I want to hear your feedback. If there are any "keys" you think I've missed, I'd appreciate the most non-spoiler word or phrase you can think of to get me to talk about it. For example ... if you had wanted me to explain the hotdog thing I just explained, you could have said something like "hotdogs" or "sandwiches on the bench" and I'd have then replied. By all means, please do so. Please try to think of a simple word or phrase to get me onto the same page you're on for our discussion. Otherwise, you're requiring me to fire off every little Sherlock Holmes observation I've made. :x
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08-07-2007, 03:23 PM | #112 | |||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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08-07-2007, 04:22 PM | #113 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
*dislikes these riddles Doppel is speaking in :x *
Whatever, I'm just going to play the game.
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08-07-2007, 09:47 PM | #114 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
On late Day 6 of Takeshi's path. FINALLY gained "Takeshi x Tsugumi" status!
Spoilers in Size 8 font below. Requesting future spoilers be put in Size 6-8, too. Size 1 is just too damn small to scroll down to. Man, the two paths are REALLY quite different, aren't they? On Kid's path, there's next to no mention of Tief Blau, whereas in Takeshi's path, it's not only hinted to be the cause of the evacuation (Sora screaming "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! NOT TIEF BLAU!"), but is 100% proven to be it with Coco -- and subsequently Takeshi and Kid and Yuu -- all coming down with it! Holy shit! So the other people were evacuated, while those who had come into direct contact with Coco were quarantined. Tsugumi seems to really love me, but we have a lot of fights where she violently departs with tears in her eyes. I don't know if that's just her being emotional or what, but I'll take her sincere concern about me coming down with Tief Blau, her emotional refusal to let me have access to her antibodies for fear I would come down with Cure, and my savefile saying "Takeshi/Tsugumi" as good signs. HOORAY FOR GETTING INTO HIMMEL! Doppel, I just thought I'd say that in Japanese, too, there is the connection between the words "heaven" and "sky." Different characters, though. The character for "Sora" is 空 and has the readings "Kuu" or "Sora" (or, more rarely, "Kara" and also the verb form "aku" 空ã ). However, it only means Sky. Not Heaven. 天 , or Ten, is the character which means "Heaven." As in tensai 天æ‰Â, tenshi 天使, tenchi 天地, or tenki 天気. As shown by the last word (meaning "weather"), Ten does have the dual meaning of not only Heaven but also Sky. I don't know if this will significantly matter or not, especially since I did not attempt to try them out via Quick Save and see what would have happened if I had made alternative decisions, but ... - I punched Kid in the face when he was talking suicide. - I asked Tsugumi and then Sora about how to open HIMMEL's door. - When Sora asked me if we were ready to go even though we could not retrace our steps once we moved on, I selected "Yes, let's go!" rather than the "Hmm, let's hold on a sec ..." option. Regarding statues ... Coco was carving the South-pointing statue this time, not the East-pointing statue! Very peculiar, especially since there should only be one Coco between both dimensions and (therefore) only one carver with only one carving. Regarding Chami ... so that's who the rat is, and why he would be included on Coco's carving! I guessed correctly that the 2nd animal was the rat, didn't I? ......... even if it wasn't entirely for the right reasons ... Also regarding Chami ... HOLY SHIT , I can't believe she did that to Chami. Even if he is infected by Cure, still ...! If I remember anything else, I'll be sure to post it. But for now ... time to beat the game! And hope I don't get a Bad End!
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08-07-2007, 10:12 PM | #115 | |||||||||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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No, nobody knew Coco had it, because no one knew the virus had been leaked somehow (which was the accident). Someone died in the IBF and that scared the crack out of the scientists, who evacuated the facility as quickly as they could - notice all the the escape vessels had been taken. When that happened, someone panicked and went through LeMU to get to the surface, which is what caused the leak of air-pressure and the eventual flooding of the complex. Takeshi, You, and Kid were unfortunate to have been held up with Coco, since she unknowingly contaminated them with the virus. Takeshi, Kid, and You were both blessed and cursed to be trapped with Coco and Tsugumi. Quote:
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Yup. And hence my hint from earlier, I think - if Sora had been monitoring on the second day, she wouldn't have seen Takeshi, Sara, and You (in Kid's Route) or Takeshi and Tsugumi (in Takeshi's Route) in the generator room because of the heat. Hence, Tsugumi could hide Chami because he was on her person. Quote:
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08-07-2007, 11:09 PM | #116 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Wow. I just beat it. I was in such disbelief that this was the "Good End" that I had to confirm it with my own eyes. Yup. *see attachment below*
I am very happy with the end because ... I've said it once, I've said it a thousand thousand thousand times -- I'm a huge sucker for tragic romances!. For that reason, I can 100% predict that BBB will hate the "Good End" of Tsugumi's path. However ... I wasn't entirely happy with the logic of it, myself. ^_^; For example ... 1 - Takeshi swallows some of Tsugumi's blood the day they kiss. Um ... *hint hint* , why wasn't she more aware of this after being so hyper-sensitive about it all game? 2 - Why couldn't he have at least attempted to swim vertically? He didn't even try. 3 - Um ... most people float when they are deeper than 10 feet under water, especially 10 feet beneath the sea, since the salinity and coldness of deep ocean water makes it really dense. So ... Takeshi sinking deeper and deeper made no sense at all. He should have fired upwards like a rocket. And exploded. >_< 4 - Which reminds me ... the scene where he bolts out of the decompression chamber and back into HIMMEL/LeMU was really ridiculous. 12.5 atm to 1 atm, and you're telling me his head didn't explode? Yeah right. Anyway ... score one for the Tal-man! Without using any online aides or anything ... without doing anything but playing the game by myself and then reporting my thoughts and feelings here at UPN ... I am 2 for 2 for Good Ends and 0 for 2 for Bad Ends. w007 w007! And one of those good ends is the notoriously difficult Tsugumi! *BBB and Doppel both cough, loudly* ... okay, so maybe I did have a little help from my two friends here. Take a bow, gentlemen! *BBB and Doppel begin to bow, but ...* Okay, enough of that! More praise for me! j/k ;) ... but I am excited I got the good end on my first try without ever having to backtrack.
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08-07-2007, 11:21 PM | #117 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Now ... some important observations. Doppel, again, please try to use larger fonts than size 1. If you use Size 8, it becomes legible within 5 clicks of the mouse wheel. If you use size 1, even if I keep doing it until the avatar box takes up the full screen, size 1 is still not legible. Copying and pasting text is a chore because (when in size 1 and in quotes) I can't seem to highlight past that sentence. And quoting is also a chore because the text loses all of its formatting. If you don't plan on trying it out, state so so I leave you alone.
Question 1: what is the terabyte disc found in Pipi's mouth? (Rhetorical question; I don't want an actual answer! @_@) I mean ... somebody had to stuff that in there and put him under the table. O_o; Question 2: Why did Pipi die? I mean ... we saw him being immune to Tief Blau the entire time. Coco loves her dog Pipi, so I can't imagine her willingly leaving the station without it. Sort of makes you wonder if the "rescue squad" that came to save everybody really did save them or not. After all ... we didn't technically get to hear Yuu's, Kid's, or Coco's voices. Just the military dude. For all we know, they may have gassed them and killed Pipi for safe measure. Question 3: Seeing as Takeshi and Tsugumi assumed Pipi was dead ... why did they bring him along? O_o Did they simply not want to abandon him to LeMU? Or did they think that maybe -- maybe -- he wasn't dead after all? Question 4: Is it a coincidence or not that Coco's father's initials were "T.Y.", i.e. Tanaka Yukie, the same name as Yuu's mother? Or [Tanaka?] Yoichiro, the same initials as her father? Makes you wonder ... is Coco's dad on the Takeshi path also Yuu's dad from the Kid path? Did he slipstream or something? Observation 1: Kid's dream on the Kid path about the capsule with the black ooze pouring from it was the same place as IML's lab! :o Observation 2: and the hallway he saw in his dream on the Kid path is the same hallway we walk down in IML!
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08-07-2007, 11:50 PM | #118 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
http://www.mediafire.com/?70i9r9tjtgn
Doppel was right ... it took a while, but I have finally fallen in love with the song. Can't say I feel the same way about most of the other songs, though. Just this one and "Karma" (the melody you here when looking at the main menu ... also the really heart-breaking song that plays when Takeshi says goodbye to Tsugumi for the last time ). But yeah. This song rocks. ;) Too bad I'm too sad to play the game right now. ;_;
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08-08-2007, 12:03 AM | #119 | ||||||||||||||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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Oh, somehow I doubt he'll be as shocked as you may think. ;) Quote:
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2. Impossible. Remember, there's fifty feet of ocean in between each level of LeMU and something like one hundred feet between Dritte Stock and the IBF. The total distance from the ocean floor there to the surface is three hundred and fifty three feet, if I remember correctly - basically a thirty five story building. Could anyone swim the length of Big Ben upward? Not even Tsugumi could do it, and she's a Cure. Quote:
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Could dogs adjust that well to such sudden changes in pressure, even with treatment? I'd imagine animals to be more sensitive than humans. Quote:
Uh, well, I'd imagine Coco would cry her heart out when she got to the surface that her dog had been left to die deep underwater. Both Takeshi and Tsugumi have a soft-spot for Coco, so...they wouldn't want to cause her grief. Quote:
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Again, good find. Hence why I was scared of Himmel/pissed off at Coco in Kid's Path - she was, to quote myself, "beckoning my character to his death".
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08-08-2007, 12:13 AM | #120 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Awww.....Suigin's already done? God damnit! I was hoping that I would finish first, but nooooooo I have a stupid job now to keep me from constant entertainment.
Anyway, I am about to finish day three, and Sora explained something to me that is well....himitsu *winks*(is that how I spell it?). Oh, Suigin, did Tsugumi get injured in your game? I was wondering, because I am still not sure whos path I am on. It's difficult to tell, since I am being thrown into both Sora and Tsugumi scenes. EDIT: N/M. I am pretty sure that I am on Sora's. I just got through with a deep conversation with her about what love means. One more question. Is it good to always know the answer to a problem? Like if they ask if you know something, is it always good to say "Yes I know."? Just curious. |
08-08-2007, 12:37 AM | #121 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
BBB AVOID WHAT TALON SAYS AT ALL COSTS, YOU ARE IN GRAVE DANGER.
... In any matter, Tsugumi is injured regardless of whose path one is on. ... BBB - usually, it is always better to look smarter than dumber, but I ask you answer truthfully whenever you can.
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08-08-2007, 12:54 AM | #122 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
In response to Doppel about pressurization:
Doppel, your answer to Q4 is not satisfactory (yet?). IIRC, the first (and only) time Takeshi and Tsugumi finally kiss and make love is on Day 7, after Takeshi has fetched her from the surface, said goodbye to Sora one last time, and gone back down below to IML. It is for certain (having just done it) during that scene where he says he's hungry and says ... "it's you, Tsugumi! You smell good!", bites her finger, and then sucks on it. Tsugumi then comments, "omg, it's bleeding!" and Takeshi's coyly like, "Oh, is it? ;)" and, for no good reason, she doesn't freak out at all. You'd think she'd have freaked massively. Also, I dunno what you know about separating out antibodies from blood serum, but ... I've done it in college labs. It can be done, and you can (quite easily) separate the antibodies against Tief Blau from the Cure virus. Very, very easily. So unless Yuu screwed up (which there is no canonical reason for me to believe yet, if ever), then we must assume that Takeshi lacks the Cure. The reason he got better is because of the antibodies against TB, not because he got Cured. Currently on Sara's path Day 3. Basically clicking the Enter key like crazy. I started from Day 1 so I could negatively reply to Yuu and Sora while positively replying to Sara. So far, I've gotten Sara to sing my finger a lullaby , and I know Kick the Can can't be too far off.
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08-08-2007, 01:02 AM | #123 | |||
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
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Takeshi is drenched by her blood following his rescue of her from the store-room, he gets a mouthful of her blood later on, they have sex in both Qualle AND in the IBF, Takeshi gets her antibodies in IBF and he sucks her blood. A lot of the other players have said, "uhh, I don't think Cure can be transferred sexually" because of the obvious implication that Tsugumi would likely have been raped so someone could get the virus. However, I believe like the AIDS virus, a lot of fluid exchange would facilitate the spread of infection. Quote:
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08-08-2007, 01:08 AM | #124 |
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Okay, you've reminded/convinced me about [you know what] getting into [you know where] before Day 7, *BUT* you haven't convinced me that _u_e developed so suddenly. Why? Because, Tsugumi herself said it -- it takes 5 years for every cell to become affected, so ... a person in _______'s position should still have been in serious trouble after decompressioning so suddenly. Instead of 5 years, they only had 5 days. (worded vaguely enough to avoid our annoying pseudo-spoiler tag)
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08-08-2007, 01:21 AM | #125 | |
我が名は勇者王!
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Re: Ever17 ―the out of infinity―
Quote:
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