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Old 07-01-2015, 04:07 PM   #1
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I don't get it

Just read it. How are those comments resign-worthy, and how are they sexist to the point of provoking global outrage in the form of attractive scientists posting selfies online?

I can't tell if this article is satirical or not.

Bloody brits, you and your dry humour!
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Old 07-01-2015, 04:33 PM   #2
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Because he heavily implied that women shouldn't be in laboratories and called them incredibly and overly emotional? As the Royal Society rightly points out, those views have no place in science. Hunt has done remarkable work. That is not to be disputed. But his moronic comments, coming from a highly influential Nobel Prize winner, are arguably even more damaging as a result. There was no "joke" here Doppel; he apologised for offence caused but stood by his comments making it extremely hollow and showing he was serious about them.

If indeed he and people in his lab have fallen in love and find it that disruptive, then perhaps they ought to a) exercise some professionalism and b) perhaps not extend his experience to the whole female gender?
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Old 07-01-2015, 04:57 PM   #3
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Slow day, eh? Plenty of better and more interesting controversial sexism drama elsewhere. Surprised we don't have a thread for "that" topic, the one involving gamers and gates.
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:05 PM   #4
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can we fuckin not
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:08 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Son_of_Shadows View Post
Because he heavily implied that women shouldn't be in laboratories and called them incredibly and overly emotional?
There has to be more context because as you've phrased it, it sounds like people seeing what they want to see.

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That is not to be disputed. But his moronic comments, coming from a highly influential Nobel Prize winner, are arguably even more damaging as a result.
I don't think that's a defensible position. It's like saying Erwin Schrodinger's contributions to quantum mechanics don't outweigh his monstrously vile personal life. Most physicists of today would not think so.

Granted, I know nothing of this man or his accomplishments and he could be a habitually huge douche, and he was clearly not reading the room to say that to a public audience, but I've heard far more damning things on a routine basis on various pulpits that don't lead to resignations.

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If indeed he and people in his lab have fallen in love and find it that disruptive, then perhaps they ought to a) exercise some professionalism and b) perhaps not extend his experience to the whole female gender?
This comment is a great example of what I don't understand - you're appropriating what is basically an anecdote as a statement about all women, and then criticizing the women who fell in love for being un-professional. It's like saying the people who are hurt most by his comments are unrelated third parties hearing his comments through secondary sources.

It would make more sense if the identity of the women in question were exposed and publicly shamed by the comments. This hullabaloo makes zero sense and I can't relate at all.
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:10 PM   #6
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Did you read your own article Dopple, because I seriously doubt it from your post.
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:11 PM   #7
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can we fuckin not
but low hanging fruit is so tasty!
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:23 PM   #8
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You cannot be serious.
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:31 PM   #9
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Did you read your own article Dopple, because I seriously doubt it from your post.
It seems we're at an impasse, because I cannot see how those comments are insensitive to the degree of resignation. Jocular? Clearly. But it isn't clear to me how female dignity was irrevocably harmed, and it's easy to see how the Royal Society was impacted.
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:40 PM   #10
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This hullabaloo makes zero sense and I can't relate at all.
At the risk of this sounding too much like a personal attack (and it's not at all meant to be), that's your problem right there. I'm not suggesting feelings or emotions belong in a debate, but there's an empathy component that is I find to be necessary in many cases that is simply absent here.
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Old 07-01-2015, 05:53 PM   #11
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If you can't relate to something, that makes it all the more difficult to understand or sympathize with it. This is a fairly common issue in internet debates..
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Old 07-01-2015, 06:00 PM   #12
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From Reddit:

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The official quotes Sir Tim as saying: “It’s strange that such a chauvinist monster like me has been asked to speak to women scientists. Let me tell you about my trouble with girls. Three things happen when they are in the lab: you fall in love with them, they fall in love with you, and when you criticise them they cry. Perhaps we should make separate labs for boys and girls?

“Now seriously, I’m impressed by the economic development of Korea. And women scientists played, without doubt an important role in it. Science needs women and you should do science despite all the obstacles, and despite monsters like me.”

God fucking dammit. He was talking about how great women in science are, and was making a joke at his own expense about old white men.
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Reading his comments and knowing that he met his wife in a lab, I'm 99.9% certain it was a joke.
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Yes we knew this during the time he was in the media attention. It was obviously a joke, no one would stand up at a conference for women in science (note how media avoided reporting that) and say women don't belong in science, they wouldn't be there in the first place. It was taken out of context for outrage porn, and the saddest bit is the man has done a lot for women in science, hence why here in the UK so many scientists both male and female came out to support him, including many female students and his own wife ironically.

The proles and plebs don't care about science, they don't care about helping people, they don't care about how many people will be saved from cancer by his work, all they care is about bread and circuses.
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Old 07-01-2015, 06:26 PM   #13
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The media is based solely off lying and slander to get people riled, regardless of which sort of media. That people can't take a joke's ust another reason I want human extinction to be a thing.
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Old 07-01-2015, 06:30 PM   #14
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Lying in the news is fully illegal. If you are quoted as saying "Kill all men" when you didn't say "Kill all men," you can sue the paper for a tidy sum as long as you can prove it was damaging to your reputation.

This is a trickier beast. It is a misrepresented position, and it is also damaging to the man's reputation, but is it an outright written lie? He said those things. The media left out other things that would have made his intended position clear.

Not to mention most people don't read much beyond the headline.
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Old 07-01-2015, 06:36 PM   #15
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My point still stands as my reaction as well as others were entirely fair given the biased presentation of the article.
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Old 07-01-2015, 08:14 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son_of_Shadows View Post
Because he heavily implied that women shouldn't be in laboratories and called them incredibly and overly emotional? As the Royal Society rightly points out, those views have no place in science. Hunt has done remarkable work. That is not to be disputed. But his moronic comments, coming from a highly influential Nobel Prize winner, are arguably even more damaging as a result. There was no "joke" here Doppel; he apologised for offence caused but stood by his comments making it extremely hollow and showing he was serious about them.

If indeed he and people in his lab have fallen in love and find it that disruptive, then perhaps they ought to a) exercise some professionalism and b) perhaps not extend his experience to the whole female gender?


I wish this were Reddit, so I could give you some gold for that post. I got nothing else to add.
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Old 07-01-2015, 09:36 PM   #17
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Yes, god forbid anyone ever make a joke about anyone other than caucasian straight males.

It's pretty obvious he isn't seriously saying women have no place in science. Hell, he's making fun of himself just as much as he's poking a joke at the stereotype of women being distracting to men in the workplace. Notice how he says, "You fall in love with them." If all that Talon quoted is true, he's obviously referencing himself and how he fell in love with his wife in the lab. Hell, it's just as "insulting" to men as it is to women, making them seem like they all just drop whatever they're doing to get a peek at a chick.

If we legitimately lost his job and good name for this, then what the fuck is wrong with people. Much worse things have been said that have achieved the same result, or even no consequences. This is like telling a knock knock joke in comparison.

I mean, if Talon's sources are off, then I take back some of this. But if that context is correct, well see the above.
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Old 07-01-2015, 09:51 PM   #18
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salt af because people focus on blurbs
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Old 07-01-2015, 11:15 PM   #19
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Today on the age-old adage of "don't believe everything you read"...
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Old 07-01-2015, 11:45 PM   #20
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Honestly I'm not going to fully involve myself with this. I will simply say this:

In a professional and prestigious environment like this where you represent a large body with lots of interests riding on your good conduct, it would behoove one to cater their jokes to the lowest common denominator. While this is rather stupid since worse scandals have left the person practically untouched (I can think of a President), he wasn't exactly in the right, either.
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Old 07-01-2015, 11:48 PM   #21
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Resign worthy? Today, possibly. 10 years ago, probably not.

Internet media can really amplify things to dramatic proportions, especially with Twitter and Facebook and the smartphone. Everyone can now voice their disapproval whereas years ago, it wouldn't have had been heard by the whole world and it would have only invoked a response from like a handful of people.
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Old 07-01-2015, 11:57 PM   #22
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Internet media can really amplify things to dramatic proportions, especially with Twitter and Facebook and the smartphone. Everyone can now voice their disapproval whereas years ago, it wouldn't have had been heard by the whole world and it would have only invoked a response from like a handful of people.
Welcome to Internet 3.0: Outrage Culture
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Old 07-02-2015, 08:32 AM   #23
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Resign worthy? Today, possibly. 10 years ago, probably not.

Internet media can really amplify things to dramatic proportions, especially with Twitter and Facebook and the smartphone. Everyone can now voice their disapproval whereas years ago, it wouldn't have had been heard by the whole world and it would have only invoked a response from like a handful of people.
It's not that everyone can now voice their disapproval. If that was true, you'd know what everyone thinks about something, instead of what a small minority thinks about it. The thing is that now in the Internet age, as 4chan proved, you can get people to pay attention to you.

To me, attention is literally porn. My sexual fantasies revolve around being noticed and found attractive by increasingly hot men/women. When nobody pays attention to me, I become sad and depressed. I love being a central enough part of any group that they will mention and describe me even when I'm not present. I know that many people do not comment on reddit or yahoo. I do. I love when my comments get noticed and approved of. Some people don't - they like to lurk, and they don't really care about attention. That is not me.

So what you have here is a bunch of people looking for attention who hold a political opinion and they comment on it on Twitter, looking for attention. And they get noticed. And mentioned on the NATIONAL NEWS. This would be a drug for me, if something I did was on the national news and everyone knew about it and approved of it. I would smoke it or inject it and start looking for more.

The accusations fly faster and thicker and as companies react like startled horses, changing internal policies based on the whim of what is really .0001% of the population but sounds like everyone, they look farther and faster for the next dose of attention. They're addicts scrambling for a fix at this point, and they're literally unable to stop themselves.

I personally think internet outrage culture is adorable. It's become startlingly clear that it's a toddler throwing a series of tantrums in public. The steady parade of outrage is beginning to remind me of this site about the crazy and stupid cadre of reasons kids just randomly start bawling.

"He has a cereal bar in his left hand but he wants it in his RIGHT hand."

"I wouldn't let him spray the trees with sunscreen."

"Grandma told him he looked like his dad when he was the same age."

"I told him he has human bones, not dinosaur bones."
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It's not an outrage culture, it's a series of appeals for attention. There is no culture here - they may have some of the criteria for being a culture, but they're missing a lot of things. They are better off mentioned in the same way as the Tea Party was: as a small and radical subset of a larger cultural group. But don't feel bad; this feeling of helplessness as a small group of radical people takes charge of your movement and makes you look like a bunch of idiots is exactly what moderate Republicans felt on a daily basis just a few short years ago.
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Old 07-02-2015, 10:24 AM   #24
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If no one voiced their disapproval and merely just heard about it, no one would get in trouble for their stupid actions.

If he made the joke and it merely lead to every woman on the internet reading it and then simply lead to those same women giving him mean looks every time they saw him, then he wouldn't have resigned. He wouldn't have been shamed by thousands of #distractinglysexy posts and the internet wouldn't have exploded on him with that story.

Also, I don't want to know about your creepy attention boners.
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Old 07-02-2015, 12:01 PM   #25
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What he said was inappropriate. He was a man of high standing and irrespective of whether or not it was a joke, whether he was the intended target or not, what he said was inappropriate and shouldn't have crossed his mind. I'm not saying his intentions were inherently sexist or whatever, but what he said was unacceptable and he pretty much got what he deserved.

As for this being result of attention seeking, faux outrage, that's utter bollocks. The kind of people who actually spread that kind of senseless vitriol are completely ignored by mainstream media anyway. The few times they're picked up on, it's by the kind of media that nobody even takes seriously anyway.
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