05-18-2014, 01:48 PM | #2101 |
Naga's Voice
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>tries LC battles
>finally gets a win >replays dont work Screw you too ScriptSafe for wrecking everything i had set up on PS with your update.
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05-18-2014, 04:27 PM | #2102 |
Think ye can take me?
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I use Scarf Rotom-A. And I run Scarf Noivern in VGC just to troll all the little Salamances
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05-18-2014, 04:52 PM | #2103 |
プラスチック♡ラブ
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Scarf is still viable in LC where priority isn't insanely common like in OU, though Gale Wings/Sucker Punch are still problems.
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05-18-2014, 09:36 PM | #2104 |
Naga's Voice
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>LC
Skill link Aipom MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA TASTE MY FURY SWIPES
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05-19-2014, 07:46 AM | #2105 |
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You do realize that not only is Return more powerful, but its also more accurate. You dont gain anything from Fury Swipes, since Subs arent very common in LC.
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05-19-2014, 01:55 PM | #2106 |
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> Skill Link
Reading!
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05-19-2014, 02:16 PM | #2108 |
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Except Fury swipes is 9 times of ten effective enough to kill the opponent anyway. And I have Thief to kill Ghosts with.
If Fury Swipes doesn't kill it it means its got eviolite and return wouldn't be doing much more.
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05-19-2014, 02:26 PM | #2109 |
時の彼方へ
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It's one thing for you to make incorrect claims. It's another for you to be so immature that you can't admit when you're wrong and you move the goal posts instead. Myles, please admit that Cloneblazer was correct about Return doing more damage than a Skill Linked Fury Swipes would do.
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05-19-2014, 02:29 PM | #2110 |
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I'm talking about LC anyway, sure, return does more damage but not by much.
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05-19-2014, 03:10 PM | #2111 |
Barghest Barghest Barghe-
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>using thief to kill Ghosts
Myles I don't even. Knock Off is about a million times better and allows you to run Life Orb... oh wait life orb worst item
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05-19-2014, 03:13 PM | #2112 |
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Thief is good when using a consumable, like Sitrus Berry, and with Eviolite rampant in LC, it's VERY nice to have.
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05-19-2014, 03:14 PM | #2113 |
Barghest Barghest Barghe-
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>Sitrus Berry
*flips tables and walks out of thread* Talon wanna make a UPN Victory Road?
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05-19-2014, 03:16 PM | #2114 |
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Or we could actually live up to the name "Happy Fun Times", realize it works anyway, and forget about it?
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05-19-2014, 03:32 PM | #2115 |
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While I sympathize, I'm actually interested to hear the Thief explanation. It sounds like it would go something like this:
It seems like a bit of a gimmick though. If the move were to prove popular, people would begin to expect it; expecting it, they would begin to recognize common Thief users and would switch out the turn you plan to use Thief; and thus you'd do a piddly amount of damage to whatever they switched in while still failing to rob the opponent of a crucial item like an Eviolite. Worse, the plan requires that you don't get OHKOed. Perhaps this is reliably common in LC, I don't know, but from the recent replays Jeri shared it seems like even Little Cup sees its fair share of OHKOs. Also: I don't think Sitrus Berry is that bad. I ran one on Galvantula (OU) for the longest time per my self-enforced Item Clause (up until the Jirachi draft in 2013; and even then Choice Scarf is the only item I have more than one of on the team); and I ran one on Venusaur for the Champion League Tournament and it worked very well. Not sure why you're knocking it so badly.
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05-19-2014, 03:34 PM | #2116 |
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Talon has it down pat, and its not common yet, in fact Eviolite Slowpoke is more common-and it dies especially quickly to that.
The Average sinfle Fury swipes hit with a Stab in LC dishes around 18-24%-Making tandem Skill Link lethal unless Eviolite in is play-usially letting me take a hit to use my berry and steal the eviolite.
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05-19-2014, 03:44 PM | #2117 | |
時の彼方へ
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Quote:
What makes Knock Off attractive is the extra damage in Gen 6. Before Gen 6, I could see the argument for why Thief might be "just as good as" Knock Off. "It does a little less damage, sure, but now I gain the item. :3" But even in older generations, you don't typically see Thief on LC sets. Like ...
Cold hard numbers speak louder than arrogant opinions -- including our own. If the Thief idea really works well, show us. Show us battles where it works against players with ratings higher than 1400. Show us that you yourself can achieve (and maintain!) an Elo of 1500 or greater in Little Cup while using a Thief Pokémon. That will speak much louder than anything you or we could say based solely on rhetoric.
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05-19-2014, 03:46 PM | #2118 |
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That one battle I was going to show had me kick the ass of a Slowpoke exploiting Trick Room with this method. Then replays broke.
MONKEY the Aipom is my LC All-Star, really, with that little trick up the sleeve.
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05-19-2014, 03:49 PM | #2119 | |
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Quote:
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05-19-2014, 03:51 PM | #2120 |
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In a sense, it helps keep me from being trolled by another Thief user by giving them a second rate heal item rather than the LC Max Potion you see in Berry Juice
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05-19-2014, 04:01 PM | #2121 |
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I dunno. Not to be mean about it, Myles, but if you've been doing your LC battles as ArtemistheHunter, it looks like your LC record isn't too hot. I can't speak for others, but I know that I wouldn't be persuaded by any of your lost replays if they were against players whose scores are similar to your own. Like I said before, I'd need to see you proving time and again that the strategy works against mid-tier players for me to be convinced of anything. Looking at LC's ladder, Elo 1722 is the highest score right now and Elo 1372 represents 500th place. All of these players, even the one in 500th place, appear to have Glicko scores greater than 1650. So I would probably need to see you using Thief successfully (and winning the entire match too) against players whose Elo scores are at least 1372 and whose Glicko scores are at least 1650 to be convinced of anything. Although I say this as an LC outsider. If the LC ladder is as badly saturated as the Random Battle ladder is right now with high-tier players' alt accounts, then people intimately familiar with the LC circuit should let me know and should also let me know what a more representative Elo and Glicko score of the median player would be.
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05-19-2014, 04:34 PM | #2122 |
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Which, as you stated yourself, isn't common. At the very least not yet. And the whole point of running thief was that you reap the benefit of two items. So why, why do you nerf the first item yourself so badly? Especially since, as stated before, thief isn't common.
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05-19-2014, 04:41 PM | #2123 |
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For if/when it does become common.
Also Talon I've done like 10 LCs so far I'm still making my niche in the style.
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05-19-2014, 04:45 PM | #2124 |
Barghest Barghest Barghe-
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There isn't any reason why Thief will become common. It's a gimmick that's outclassed by Knock Off. Thief limits the items you can use, and many of the "common" users aren't bulky at all so taking an Eviolite isn't important. And while gaining an Eviolite might seem important...
196 Atk Life Orb Aipom Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 196 HP / 156+ Def Eviolite Slowpoke: 13-18 (46.4 - 64.2%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO 196 Atk Aipom Thief vs. 196 HP / 156+ Def Slowpoke: 10-12 (35.7 - 42.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO I think definetely scoring the 2HKO on Slowpoke and still having the ability to cripple other Pokemon is far better than just a gimmick
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05-19-2014, 04:50 PM | #2125 |
Aroma Lady
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So replace it when it actually IS common, if ever at all. No point to use sitrus now.
EDIT: Blaze, do those calcs include eviolite disappearing on the second hit, if not maybe thief has a shot at 2HKO (although I doubt it) |
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