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Old 04-20-2020, 05:42 AM   #5101
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Fat balance in action. Regrettably, Chansey + Wish + Teleport is not a legal combo.

I wonder if Melmetal qualifies as one of the "best" wallbreakers in natdex? It's remarkably sturdy, even to super effective physical moves. For immediate power, I don't know anything that works better aside from Tapu Lele on the special side.

Even considering the Megas...the clear #1 is Mega Blastoise, followed closely by Mega Metagross. I don't see setup sweepers fitting on fat balance that well.
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Old 04-20-2020, 04:56 PM   #5102
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Isn't Corviknight a set-up sweeper though?
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Old 04-20-2020, 11:18 PM   #5103
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No, Corviknight serves as one of the balance core's bulky walls and/or offensive pivots. The idea is endlessly switching between walls that resist or are immune to status (Clefable, Corviknight, Toxapex, Ferrothorn, Seismitoad, Kommo-o, Rotom-Heat) and use Clefable to pass Wishes with Teleport.

Melmetal was voted to remain banned today because it made "fat balance" even worse than it was before. Now there's talk about banning Clefable because this format is far too toxic and unleahtly.
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Old 04-21-2020, 09:38 AM   #5104
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I've felt like game lately have been unfair, and this proves it.
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Old 04-22-2020, 03:22 AM   #5105
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I built something similar to my OUTM builds to try out the new "fat balance" in Gen VIII OU proper.

Here's the result. There are flaws in this team that I didn't have in December, namely that Dracovish is now banded because Kyurem is way better as a scarfer.

I had an earlier team with Kommo-o in place of Excadrill, but drill is really important for Clefable. But this also leads me to be vulnerable to Excadrill itself.
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Old 04-29-2020, 01:51 PM   #5106
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Dracovish should really be banned. It's waaaay too dangerous and powerful. I say that even as someone who normally does mono Water.

At first, a Pelipper + Dracovish sweeper team looks scary. Unless you also have Dracovish.
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:13 PM   #5107
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why your name super poop 20 how old are you
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:36 PM   #5108
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All of my user names have some reference to defecation or rectal discharge, i.e. salty buttmilk or vomiting anus.

I think it's funny and humourous for opponents, while also creating the false perception that I'm an underaged player, since elementary/middle school players are far more likely to be amused by feces gags. That gives me an advantage when I pull advanced maneuvers like the double switch.
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Old 05-01-2020, 10:00 PM   #5109
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Dracovish isn't going to get banned, Seismitoad is seeing some good usage solely for "Water Absorb means I can tell choiced Vish to fuck off and also just switch safely into vish as a rule." Dracovish is a LOT less powerful when the opponent has a 'toad or some other Water Absorber/Storm Drainer in their back pocket, because it really is kind of a one trick pony-even if it gets a fair amount of other biting moves, none of them are powerful enough to perform well coming from Dracovish. So, when Rend isn't such a reliable option, vish as a whole suffers in its usability.
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Old 05-02-2020, 06:04 AM   #5110
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why your name super poop 20 how old are you
Sounds like an item name in Binding of Isaac.
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Old 05-02-2020, 07:00 AM   #5111
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I have two objections to that logic.

The first is that Seismitoad, while having utility beyond a Dracovish counter, can be taken advantage of when the dex expands. The game I posted is from natdex where Dracovish is consistently sweeping teams once the scarfer or wall is removed since those teams aren't running Water Absorb Pokemon. Even if you can't set up on Seismitoad, simply removing it allows Dracovish to decimate the rest of a team.

The second problem is Dracovish's hidden ability hasn't been released yet. Sand Rush with Choice Band not only gives it an equal power Fishious Rend, but also strengthens Outrage, which doesn't get the Strong Jaw bonus. A banded Outrage is a 2HKO on physically defensive Seismitoad so a misprediction can be easily punished.

Along with Earthquake and Stone Edge, SR+Band doesn't have to risk Ferrothorn Iron Barbs either. I can see it working really well on a sand team with Tangrowth, who easily switches in on Ferrothorn and Seismitoad while resisting EQ. You could also bluff Sand Rush and still run scarf on any team with Hippowdown, who is also good right now.

Adamant Sand Rush Dracovish outspeeds up to +101 scarfers. That means only Garchomp and Serperior commonly outspeed, and neither are currently in the Gen VIII meta.

Here's another game to show what Dracovish can do against a single "scarfer". Doing 30% to Heatran means that's a specs Dragapult, but that was the team's revenge killer. Every time Dracovish was switched in, something died.
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Old 05-03-2020, 05:06 AM   #5112
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Kommo-o is so freaking clutch right now. Remember how I wrote that it was underrated last year? It's showing off those chops now with the defensive sets, and pairs stupidly well with Heatran. Both cover each other's weaknesses.

Body Press Kommo-o doesn't even fear burns, it can boost past them. I'm not convinced that Earthquake is a good coverage more for this reason, since Toxic Aegislash and Toxapex can push past it anyway.

Didn't have to use Aegislash.
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Old 05-04-2020, 09:52 AM   #5113
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Against a "real" OU team that incorporated Mega Tyranitar and Lando-T. More proof at how ridiculous Dracovish is without a dedicated check on the team.

Bulky dragon types sort of work, Haxorus and Hydreigon can eat a Fishious Rend, but man, even resists eat a buttload.
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Old 05-12-2020, 12:58 PM   #5114
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wtf happened here?

wut. I had no answers for that Blacephalon and he switched out for no reason.
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Old 05-17-2020, 12:20 PM   #5115
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Scary!, I was afraid of that Dragonite but he got a little too greedy and I was able to stop it. I had no other options at that point.

I like this team but it has a bunch of weaknesses I'm not sure how to solve yet. Gyarados suffers from major 4MSS, namely Waterfall (+STAB), Outrage, and Power Whip all have around the same effective damage output. Meanwhile, Earthquake is weaker, and Bounce needs a Z-Move to be dangerous.

So I'm in an odd spot where Gyarados and Mega Gyarados can pick/choose its checks. Power Whip breaks past Water types like Tapu Fini, but is dead weight against Steels and especially Flying and Dragon types. Earthquake is easily punished with a Flying type or a switch in, which forces Gyarados out if it's also carrying Power Whip.

Really...it needs a stronger STAB than Waterfall, although Waterfall/Twave parahax can be quite useful.
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Old 05-21-2020, 11:41 PM   #5116
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Probably one of my hardest matchups, the only thing worse would be ANOTHER water resist + Mega Lopunny.

Dracovish is indeed going to be banned, but it looks like from OU and not natdex. This is surprising, because I thought Dracovish to be OK in OU but insane in natdex. Its effect on teambuilding is no better visible than here, where you see Slowbro and Toxapex, AKA the "fat resists" on a team, in lieu of a single Water Absorb Pokemon.
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Old 05-31-2020, 03:18 AM   #5117
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You face these sometimes. They suck.
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Old 06-06-2020, 12:07 AM   #5118
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Yay, beat a stall team. That always feels good.

Yet, at the same time, I was accused of using stall...

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Old 06-06-2020, 04:24 AM   #5119
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You are running two pokemon with Toxic, THE epitome of stally moves. As much as they're technically not correct about your midrange setup being dedicated to the idea of simply outlasting the enemy, I can hardly blame them for coming to that conclusion.
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Old 06-07-2020, 02:48 AM   #5120
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Actually, I have three mons with Toxic.

For the second time while awake, I have to wonder if people don't know how to battle Aegislash.
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Old 06-07-2020, 11:57 PM   #5121
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Okay, I basically stalled this player. That Gardevoir interaction had me realize that Soundproof isn't that great against what Kommo-o would like to check afterall.

I've found that Bulletproof, Soundproof, and Overcoat are all niche abilities. Bulletproof is rarely useful seeing as Dragapult and Gengar have alternate moves they can use to hit at least neutrally, while Soundproof's chance at surprise is hurt by Trace. Overcoat is basically only good at swallowing Sleep Powder and Spore, and against Breloom Bulletproof is more useful.

I'm still unsure about Defog on Lando. Only one Pokemon on my team is weak to rocks: Gyarados. I'm not sure I'd use Stealth Rock in its place, though. Really I'd like to fit defog on something like...Dracovish.

Taunt, Defog, and Dracovish's coverage moves are the most niche of what I run. Gyarados and Aegislash have the most utility as I'm almost always using all eight moves.
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Old 06-19-2020, 05:51 PM   #5122
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Altaria

It ain’t over til it’s over

Oh my gosh this was wild, def lucky plays from both sides but in the end I will reign supreme 😤
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Old 06-19-2020, 06:53 PM   #5123
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Rising Voltage and Expanding Force are freaking powerful in Monotype. I played a friend a series of times, and their Electric-type team beat me every time, thanks to Rising Voltage and Electric Terrain. I managed to get in a few good hits with Expanding Force on Psychic Terrain, and almost all the uses of those moves were OHKOs.
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Old 06-19-2020, 11:41 PM   #5124
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I haven't seen either of those because the Tapus don't have them yet. In natdex I've seen several Urshifu and Grassy Glide Rillaboom, one Galarian Slowbro and no Zarude. I have used Zarude though.

Tried out Earthquake Gyarados, struggled with a team I should beat easily with Power Whip. It's just that Earthquake pairs better with Waterfall on this particular set: Waterfall + Thunder Wave for parahax, Earthquake for electrics and grounded steels.

I've really grown to like Mega Gyarados. The Dark typing isn't that good (I think Ground would be better) but it has uses, at the very least swapping Gyarados' resistances and immunities. It's a great lure for Prankster users like Sableye and Grimmsnarl, while baiting psychic-type attackers. The biggest change though is swapping a fighting resistance for a dark resistance, which is especially useful against Urshifu since all Urshifu players click Wicked Blow when staring down Gyarados.
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Old 06-20-2020, 10:49 PM   #5125
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Yeah EQ didn't last, I switched back to Power Whip. Breaking bulky waters is more important than hitting steels super effectively.

I almost paid the price here. My Gyarados is very bulky because I did the cals and it needs to be at +2 to be able to break Tapu Fini and a lot of other bulky attackers. Mega Metagross does 54% with Thunder Punch, so I would have been in a bit of a bind without the lucky flinch.

I did make a mistake and not start boosting in front of the Excadrill. I was afraid that the LO Dragapult would have Draco Meteor and I wouldn't be able to hurt it with Kommo-o. Ghostium Z Dragapult, a set I was one of the first to use in natdex, is also my team's biggest weakness. Hence why I had Gyarados prioritize paralyzing the Dragapult rather than attack.

EDIT: Here's a battle using a team I would "think" counters my own. Basically all the annoying things that usually mess me up.
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