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Old 02-16-2013, 11:08 AM   #1651
deoxys
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That was really fucking good.

My only gripe is that now we have to wait god knows how long for both the movie and season four. It's only fucking February; We'll more than likely have Pokemon X and Y before we see the next episode of pony

Spoiler: show
I'm so glad it happened. I wasn't sure how the hell they were going to fit that entire plot into one episode, but they did, I really wished it had been two episodes at least, but Meghan said on her twitter that she considered this to be the first of three parts... so we'll see I guess.

I don't know why the FUCK everyone was getting their jimmies rustled at Twilight becoming an alicorn or a princess. It's called CHARACTER EVOLUTION, people. I'm not joking, ever since the hub spoilerifically revealed two weeks ago that Twilight was going to become a Princess and then showed Princess Twilight off at every moment they could, everyone has been up in arms over this shit. "She'll be a Mary Sue!" "She'll become OP!" Twilight's character was beginning to get a bit dull with the repetitiveness of her story, so they needed to basically tie up most of her loose ends and give her a new challenge: taking on the responsibility of a princess and alicorn. Not to mention, "Mary Sue"? Really? She's been around for 64 episodes already and is a well developed character. Totally stupid to assume that.

The episode was a musical, and REALLY good at that. Shit, everything about this episode was pretty much perfect. I just wish it had been longer. It's really everything I wanted it to be, honestly.

Twilight is best pony. Twilight is best princess. Celestia's song and twilight's memories almost brought a tear to my eye. That was emotional and really stellar (literally).



Spoiler: show

Last edited by deoxys; 02-16-2013 at 11:18 AM.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:14 AM   #1652
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This is the end of the brony fandom, kthxbai.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:14 AM   #1653
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That is all.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:16 AM   #1654
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What the fuck, guys? You too?


Fucking seriously?
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:18 AM   #1655
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Yes. I haven't watched MLP for quite some time. When I stumbled across Meghan's quote "Every little girl wants to be a princess" I knew it was pchaw goodbye. That is not why I got into FiM, not at all, and that's the end.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:35 AM   #1656
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Spoiler your shit, man, fuck.

And that has nothing to do with how storytelling works. Read at my comment above and then realize how wrong you are.

You're being retarded.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:43 AM   #1657
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Also if you had read the ACTUAL CONTEXT and not just base your judgement off of a stupid fucking picture floating around...

Spoiler: show
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meghan McCarthy
Those challenges will include living up to that lofty new title. In MLP‘s Equestria, “princess” is a designation that’s earned, not freely given — and though princesses have specific leadership roles in pony society, being one really means “being a good pony who shares the gifts that they have been given with others,” according to McCarthy.
“We’re building a very unique mythology around being a princess,” she continues. “Every little girl wants to be a princess, and not everybody can get to be a princess — but you can live up to the ideals that should come along with being a princess.”
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:43 PM   #1658
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Good episode, really should have been a two-parter though.
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Old 02-16-2013, 02:24 PM   #1659
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So, Season 3 Episode 13 ...

Spoiler: show


YES?



YEEEEEES?



FUCK. YES.

Now, I have to admit: my enjoyment of this episode was seriously dampened by some news my friend told me last night. ^^; All episode long, I was excited to see what the episode had in store for Twilight, and I was not disappointed. But last night, my friend told me this:
Quote:
The bronies are furious about what's going to air tomorrow. And so the episode's staff writer, Meghan McCarty, blogged that she envisions tomorrow's episode as only the first part of a three-parter. Soooooo ... what's happening tomorrow, and that I can't tell you about, is probably going to be undone by the end of the three-parter and everything will be back to normal.
So like ... part of me wanted to see Twilight become an alicorn, and it seemed so likely given all of the hints all season long and given how fucking awesome it would be ... and yet part of me didn't want to see her become one, given my friend's warning. "Because if Twilight becomes an alicorn," I worried, "then that'll mean that they're going to undo it in the fall! And if they undo it, then they're obviously not going to later re- do it! D: That'll be it! Once undone, forever undone! So no, I don't want her to become one tomorrow! Wait until Season 4! " So ... I wasn't really able to enjoy the entire coronation scene as a result. ^^; I should have. But curse my friend for planting that seed of misery-worry in me.

Reading deoxys's quote of Meghan's message though gives me some hope that my friend was dead wrong. To hear Meghan explain it, it sounds like Hasbro is committed to keeping Twilight as an alicorn princess, and that Season 4 is going to be hugely built around exploring her new responsibilities to her friends, to Ponyville, and to all of Equestria. And I am perfectly fine with that. Alicorn Twilight vs. Queen Chrysalis? Alicorn Twilight vs. King Sombra? Alicorn Twilight vs. some typical Big Bad? Bring it. Let's rumble.


Look at Luna: not all are amused by this development.

If Meghan is indicating that Princess Twilight Sparkle is here to stay (FUCK YES, FUCK YES, FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES and fuck all you Twilight haters, you can go suck on ten bags of rotten apples ), then I can imagine that this is the death of MLP:FiM for a lot of bronies. So many bronies hate on Twilight, and so many bronies decided, for whatever reason , that Twilight being a latent alicorn would be fucking stupid and thus ruin the series for them if she were ever revealed to be one. Guess they won't be joining us for Season 4 then. On the flipside, if Hasbro worries themselves sick over the bronies' anger over this plot twist and decide to retcon it in Season 4 Episode 1 or Episode 2, then ... I'll probably quit watching , as Twilight is my favorite character, her becoming an alicorn has been my biggest wish since Season 1, and so them retconning it would poison the series so, so bad for me. LET'S SEE WHO GETS THEIR WISH! I won't be too surprised if I lose out since the bronies are so whiny and vocal, and since Hasbro has clearly been violating the oldest rule of scriptwriting -- don't let your writers interact with the fandom --, but I will be pretty darn stoked if I win this fight.


Beautiful.

The animation in this episode was, by MLP:FiM's standards, top notch. Lots of great shots of Twilight Sparkle, lots of great shots of all of the other supporting characters. I guess my only regret animation-wise is that Twilight didn't get to meet Starswirl the Bearded. I was kinda hoping the episode would've revealed that she was either a) his great-great-(n)-great-granddaughter or else that she was a descendant from one of his other relations (like a sister or a brother of his). And I was hoping that when Celestia whisked her off to that aetherial plane, she might've run into Starswirl there. Or, in the likely event that he's dead, a spectral recording he left behind for his descendant who managed to complete the one magic spell that eluded him 'til the day he died. Oh well. Maybe in Season 4. This is more of a plot complaint than an animation complaint, but I bring it up here 'cause I would've liked to have seen Starswirl's form. Maybe we've seen him before, I forget if we have, but I still would've liked to have seen him here, animated, whether looking youthful or aged or whatever.

More pictures:


As for thoughts on the rest of the episode ... I'm actually a whole lot less enthusiastic or forgiving. ^^;

One thing my friend and I discussed last night was how the songs, ever since Season 2 started, have felt much more forced and shoehorned in. "Musical numbers for musical numbers' sakes" rather than them actually making any sort of aesthetic sense or benefiting the narrative more than the usual approach to telling a story would. I shared with him how some fans, including some UPNers, have argued that Daniel Ingram is like the next Tim Rice or Alan Menken and deserves an Emmy for his work. And I ... don't feel that way at all. Daniel Ingram is what I'd call "a professional by trade, an amateur by product." Yes, he's a "pro" in the sense that he actually gets paid to do what he does. But no, I don't feel like his work on MLP:FiM is anywhere near as good as many fans make it out to be. It isn't better than the music in other award-winning kids shows like Avatar: the Last Airbender -- you cannot compare what we just heard to Leaves from the Vine, Agni Kai, or the main theme song -- nor does it even come close to comparing with the music in Disney's four classic Renaissance films (The Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, and The Lion King). So to have an entire episode of MLP:FiM be devoted to nothing but amateur-grade musical numbers was pretty blegh for me. ^^; And to have it be my ALICORN episode was ... disappointing. ^^;; But oh well. At least some of the songs weren't cringe-inducingly cheesy. ^^;;;

The other thing I wasn't too keen on this episode was the plot in the first half or so. We've already had an episode where the girls are no longer acting like themselves and Twilight has to remind them of who they truly are: Season 2 Episode 2, with her covert battle against Discord. Also, all plot thread long, I was a bit uneasy 'cause I just KNEW that the largely nerdy, high school and college-age brony fanbase was thinking, "This is crap! Fate? Destiny? What are they teaching these young impressionable girls!? Choose your own destiny, man! Fight the system!" And like ... yeah, I can see the attraction to free will over fatalism, but like, MLP:FiM has been pretty fatalistic since Day fucking One with the whole idea of Nightmare Moon's release from her prison having been prophecied since a thousand years ago. ^^;; So like, ... I don't mind the fatalism myself, but seeing it crop up in such a major episode like a season finale, I just knew it would cause a shitstorm online. Sigh, oh well.
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:16 PM   #1660
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Well, time for thoughts and things.

The episode as a whole
Spoiler: show
I gotta say it, personal feelings of Alicorn!Twi aside, this was a very subpar episode for MLP. The musical numbers, like Talon said, felt incredibly forced. I was hard pressed to find a song I actually liked in this episode and I still haven't been able to. S3 had some of the best songs so far (Ballad of the Crystal Ponies, the song about being unprepared) but these were just not great. I think this is mostly caused by my other main problem with the episode: the pacing.

Oh my god, the pacing. If they had made it two episodes it would've been fine but instead they smashed it all into one and made it a mess. Within five minutes we went from "How are we going to solve this problem?!" to "Lol problem solved. Princess upgrade pls." It was just horrible. They made it so songs were uncomfortably wedged between scant explanations and a half-thought out plot. Honestly just lazy/bad/other negative words.

In my bottom five episodes for the series.


All I'm going to say on the You-Know-What issue is that I'm not a fan of it. I'm not going into anymore detail on it as I really don't want to turn this thread into a bunch of arguing like every other "discussion" I've seen on other sites has turned into. I'd rather just stay as the ambiguous negative and keep the thread civil than have it fall into shambles.
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:35 PM   #1661
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I'm just incredibly disappointed with everyone today. All of the "major" opinions behind the whole thing, the ones a lot of the vocal fans are agreeing on, I've just been shaking my head all day long. Faith: Diminishing

At least I was able to put it aside for a few moments because even though I don't agree with what they're getting at, I found this video funny. Warning, spoilers:

Spoiler: show
BORKED
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:43 PM   #1662
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deoxys View Post
I'm just incredibly disappointed with everyone today.
Okay, fine: don't write up an Anime forum treatment post next time for an MLP episode deo wanted me to be excited about.

Felt the same way as you about the fan video: didn't agree with what they were getting at, but chuckled at quite a few of the jokes.

S3E13 spoilers:
Spoiler: show
In 2nd place we have Twilight using her unicorn teleportation magic while Rainbow Dash is trying to suggest that Twilight's new wings could be used to take her places faster than before. That pooooooooooor Pegasus.

In 1st place we have "I don't know any spells for fixing clothes! " hahahaha
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Old 02-16-2013, 04:15 PM   #1663
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I loved your analysis, I think you made a lot of great points. I do think your friend is wrong, I believe that this will be a permanent change, it's more or less people who aren't a fan of it going "Maybe this isn't a permanent thing! It'll all be reverted back to normal, especially given that Meghan said there are two more parts! ". I'm not saying this as a fan of the change, I'm saying this as that it wouldn't make sense logically for them to go back on this, though I am worried that enough bitching and moaning will persuade them to do so.

I was debating someone about it and they likened it to
Spoiler: show
"OH SO IF HARRY POTTER BECAME PRINCIPAL OF HOGWARTS IN HIS THIRD YEAR AND BECAME AS POWERFUL AS DUMBLEDORE THAN YOU'D CALL THAT CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING"


I mean for fuck's sake, way to miss the point.

Spoiler: show
The point is Twilight has been developing for a whole 65 episodes as a character studying magic. In Cutie Mark Chronicles, it was made very clear that Celestia saw something more in her and thus took her under her wing. The whole 'studying magic' jig has been simmering and coming to a slowdown. They needed to reinvigorate the direction of the story and it was very obvious the best way to do that was to add more challenges for her to overcome by doing this.

Now a lot of people are upset about her friends bowing to her and think that "great, this means she's going to start ignoring her friends for Princess duties and when everyone does see her, they'll start bowing and shit >", but there is no way in hell that is going to happen. First off, the bowing thing was symbolic, and it's a trope that has been done TIME AND TIME AND TIME AGAIN in movies or shows where a main character is discovered to be royalty, and her/his friends bow to him. It's congratulatory, for pete's sake.

OH, and the whole 'All little girls want to be a princess' Meghan quote that gets taken out of context? How can anyone NOT read that as "WORK HARD TOWARDS YOUR DREAMS AND YOU WILL ACHIEVE THEM!"?

I could keep ranting, but I'm getting tired of doing so. Ugh.


Anyway, I didn't mean everyone in a literal sense, heh. I meant encompassing the general opinions of the internet as a whole on this one.


Spoiler: show
I know you of all people have especially been hoping for this, so I've been trying my best to keep you spoiler free on it (unlike the rest of us who the Hub spoiled with their dumb commercials about it and promotions way early on). Now the question is: What is she the princess of? What will her duties be? Will she succeed Celestia? Obviously there will be a struggle maintaining her normal life and this one, which comes with the challenges of the new developments, so I look forward to that.


Anyway, have some lovely artwork I found (no idea who the artist is)(SPOILER):

Spoiler: show

Last edited by deoxys; 02-16-2013 at 04:21 PM.
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Old 02-16-2013, 04:24 PM   #1664
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Alright, I walked into this knowing full well what was going to happen. That said, here are a couple things everyone should know prior to me giving my thoughts.

I have disliked Twilight for a while now, due to her not really having as much of a personality. Her character growth comes at the beginning and end of every season.

I also have known the intention on this has been around for quite some time, but obviously they weren't going to do it any earlier than this.

That said, my thoughts on the episode:

The first half went very well in my opinion, the ponies that took on eachother's roles could not have been any more perfect. That said, it felt rushed and they easily could have made an entire episode out of it, ending with Twilight getting blasted by beams. The musical bit was also very well done, so that was a plus.

The second, more controversial, half was well, less than what I expected. I understand that Celestia had been training Twilight for this, but just the way they went about it felt wrong, though I do approve of the flashbacks. The coronation ceremony was bland, stretched out to be more than it needed to be, and completely predictable. Again, this half probably could have been an entire episode if done right.

I do like that they gave Twilight some actual development, but the way they went about it seems off. On top of that, ew her wings are huge and unnatural. That said I'm sure watching her learn to be a princess will be interesting, and I did notice a somewhat worried look in Celestia's eyes while Twilight was riding away, so let's hope that means a very interesting plot twist to come.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:41 PM   #1665
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Someone pointed out that at around the 20-minute mark, the pony behind Applejack vanishes. I believe it's not that she vanishes but rather that she's suddenly relocated a bit farther away from Applejack. (Pretty sure those two are the same pony, anyway.) But it is a pretty funny error the first time you see it.

Rewatching the episode, ...

Spoiler: show
My favorite song is probably Celestia's. Was great to hear her sing, and I liked the melody as well as the sound of her voice.

Also, rewatching the episode, I am struck once again by how much this feels like a series finale (rushed and all!) rather than a mid-series season finale. They could easily end MLP:FiM right here and it'd be happily ever after as far as I'm concerned. A fourth season, should Twilight remain an alicorn, is just icing on the cake.

Y'know, I just considered something ... I like this development, a lot of bronies hate it, right? Well, there are two ways I said this could go: keep the change (yay) or undo the change to placate the angry bronies (boooooo). But there's another thing they could do in addition to simply keeping the change: they could do it some more. One possibility would be an early-to-mid Season 4 episode involving, you guessed it, Trixie. True to so many fans' dreams (or, I guess in RR's case, nightmares? ^^; ), they could have Trixie be Luna's pupil and become Twilight's alicorn partner. Sure would be sooooomething~ ;D ( @ anticipated fan rage) And if you think that's bad, consider this: what if they end Season 4 with all of the Mane Six becoming alicorns? XD What then!? hahahahaha Allow me to say, I'm just teasing and I seriously doubt this'll happen. But you never knooooooow ...
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Old 02-16-2013, 09:42 PM   #1666
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Well you're definitely not the first to jokingly theorize that all of the Mane 6 will become alicorns, quite a number of fans actually think it's a possibility for them all to become princesses of their own respectable element and twilight can live immortally happy ever after knowing she won't outlive her friends (which is a big problem fans have with her being an alicorn now).

But I doubt they would do this given the backlash they're getting on this, but whatever. As for your alicorn Trixie idea... a big ehhhhhhhh to that from me. I like Trixie and I like her as a rival for Twilight, but when you get Meghan responding to theories of Trixie taking over the now empty unicorn slot on the Mane 6, I think it's safe to assume that would never happen in anyone's wildest dreams.

I agree, it definitely felt very final. Like the series could end right there and I think a lot of people would be satisfied (although I personally wouldn't want it to, I think there are still a lot of stories they can/need to tell [I'm REALLY hoping for a flashback to the night Celestia banished Luna, or their fight with Discord]).

I do wonder how S4 will open. Given that the movie just finished production in animation on December 21st, I think it's safe to say there is a very good chance S4 will kick off with a movie, or there will be on midway through the year. Perhaps this could be the part two Meghan spoke of? And even if it's not, what will these parts two and three consist of? Whatever it is, I have a feeling Discord will be involved. Perhaps that rumor that Discord is actually Starswirl the Bearded is correct. Wouldn't that be something?
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:03 PM   #1667
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deoxys View Post
Perhaps that rumor that Discord is actually
Spoiler: show
Starswirl the Bearded is correct.
Wouldn't that be something?
Baseless rumor or evidence-based rumor? I wouldn't really care for ...

Spoiler: show
... Discord to be Starswirl the Bearded since the one is an abstract concept animated whereas the other is a named pony who was born, lived out his life in Canterlot, and presumably died or otherwise left our realm. Now, could he have transformed into the entity known as Discord? Sure, I guess. But it seems so unlikely the staff intended that, and for a variety of reasons:
  • No Discord-related Easter eggs in the episode where Twilight time traveled, that being the episode she went to the royal library in Canterlot and rummaged through the section on Starswirl the Bearded's spells.
  • No Starswirl the Bearded Easter eggs in any of the episodes involving Discord.
  • Princess Luna seemed amused in the Hallowe'en episode when Twilight dressed up as Starswirl. Or at least, she did not seem perturbed or annoyed by it, as one might expect her to have been were Discord Starswirl.
  • Even though there were some things Starswirl didn't achieve in his lifetime (obviously; pretty much made canon in S3E13), the entire series has pretty much made him out to be MLP:FiM's Merlin, the most legendary of wizarding ponies in all of Equestria's long history. One assumes, even if incorrectly, that Starswirl had more magical power than Celestia did. Even if it were a 2-against-1 fight, it seems odd that Starswirl would lose to Celestia and Luna.
  • Were he originally a pony, why would Celestia only be interested in a) turning Discord back to stone or b) reforming the chimera version of him rather than c) finding a way to get the girls to turn him back into a pony?
  • Plenty of evidence of other animals in Equestria. No reason we have to force every non-pony back to some pony origin. And that goes for Discord too.
I mean, the only reason I can see for it is "LOL THEY BOTH HAVE GRAY BEARDS!" >_> ^^; That's ... not attractive enough to get me to want or to believe that theory to be true. One may as well theorize "LOL! CELESTIA IS ACTUALLY TWILIGHT'S MOM! Twilight's foster mom was actually just a surrogate parent who Celestia allowed to raise her biological daughter because she, Celestia, was too busy being a queen while she, Twilight's mom, was barren and couldn't have kids of her own. LOLZ! :3" I mean, I'd put that at about the same level as "Starswirl the Bearded transformed himself into Discord and has been mentally corrupted / stuck that way ever since."

In before you tell me that this is your pet theory. ^_^;
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:48 PM   #1668
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Theory stems from this

Spoiler: show


and, couldn't find the picture of the other theory someone made, but it seems to be copied over to here

http://eqmegathreads.blogspot.com/20...ord-lines.html


Definitely unlikely and grasping at straws, but it's been the talk of the town since about halfway through the season.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:15 PM   #1669
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Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. Just sounds like someone trolling. Pretending to have the inside scoop when he doesn't.
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Old 02-17-2013, 05:23 AM   #1670
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I enjoyed the eppy.

Spoiler: show

I was laughing so much at the Pinkie moments
Loved the Rarity stuff.
Songs were fun and loved seeing Twilight gain her new form.
LUNA. THAT IS ALL^^

heres hoping for more Rarity and Sparity eppys next season
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Old 02-17-2013, 10:05 AM   #1671
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Re: Discord the Bearded

No. Just no. It would break the canon timeline.

You have to remember that Discord was in power prior to Celestia and Luna taking the throne. Starswirl was mentioned several times as having been around during the princesses' reign.
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Old 02-17-2013, 11:35 AM   #1672
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Holy shit that entire episode was so emotional I almost cried. ;;

Spoiler: show
Plus the part where Pinkie drank a glass of water in order to spit it out literally made me laugh out loud.


Will respond to people's points more in-depth possibly later, but for now I'll just say I thought that the eppy was perfect. The music, the animation, the pacing: all were great. I could tell from the beginning they really put a lot of heart into it. If anything the fact that it made me want to break my silence and post to give it such high praise restores my faith in franchise. I was starting to lose interest ever since season 2.
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:33 PM   #1673
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That's probably the number one most praising review I've read of it yet. It's like a huge breath of fresh air, you have no idea.
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Old 02-17-2013, 05:21 PM   #1674
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deoxys View Post
That's probably the number one most praising review I've read of it yet. It's like a huge breath of fresh air, you have no idea.
Don't handle disagreement well, eh?
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Old 02-17-2013, 06:23 PM   #1675
deoxys
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It's not the disagreement, it's the whining "omg the show is over" "the fandom is dead" "she's a mary sue now" etc. when people are missing the point

I have only heard maybe one good argument as to why it could possibly be a bad thing and that's about it, everyone else is just bitching for the sake of bitching. I'm not even kidding, there was a guy on reddit who said he was quitting the show and burning all of his merch.

I saw this on a discussion thread and it seems this guy gets it.

Spoiler: show

Last edited by deoxys; 02-17-2013 at 06:28 PM.
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