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Old 03-16-2018, 09:28 AM   #4677
Talon87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
The biggest waste in the game is Deoxys-A, who drops from a BST of 600 to an effective BST of 420.

Next is Aegislash-Blade, who goes from 520 to 370.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger View Post
Outside of very case-specific situations (like Nidoking), most Pokemon run either a physical or a special set, and don't attempt to run mixed. You don't run mixed because you can't EV train for both offensive stats AND speed, while another team member probably specializes in the category you didn't, so running a subpar mixed stat has the opportunity cost of a utility or coverage move.
Okay, so, here's your problem. You're right that mixed is a lot less common than SpAtk-only, Atk-only, or defensive builds ... but you're taking that correct general rule and stretching it too far. A lot of the Pokémon you're listing off in your newest list can and do run mixed builds, but Deoxys-A and Aegislash are especially egregious inclusions on your list.

Deoxys-A: This Pokémon is a pretty good poster child for scenarios where your Atk, SpAtk, and Speed are all so egregiously high that you really ought to be maxing out Atk/SpAtk (pick one) and Speed but then you also want to be using the neglected of the two offensive stats too because it helps you handle chump defensive switch-ins meant to force you out.

Here is Deoxys-A's top-listed build on Smogon right now:
Deoxys-Attack @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
- Psycho Boost
- Superpower
- Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse
As you can see, it's a SpAtk-leaning Deoxys with three special attack moves and ~all EVs poured into SpAtk and Speed. So far, so normal. But notice something else? His nature is Rash, not Modest or Timid. He has Superpower, a strong physical move. And his final 4 EVs? They were placed in Atk, not any of the three remaining (defensive) stats. That's because this particular Deoxys-A build focuses on primarily being a special attacker but not getting walled by the likes of Chansey/Blissey either. Deo-A's Attack stat is already so high that you don't really need to worry (that much) about the lack of EV investment or lack of stat promotion via Nature -- it's still high enough that, so long as it's not being impeded, it's going to do plenty of damage to things that can't shrug off Fighting-type physical moves.

Aegislash: This guy shouldn't be on your list at all. All three builds -- dedicated physical, dedicated special, and mixed -- are common, and once again the top recommendation out of both Smogon and VGC calls for a mixed set:
Smogon:
Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
Sassy Nature
- King's Shield
- Toxic
- Gyro Ball
- Shadow Ball

VGC 2018:
Aegislash @ Ghostium Z
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
Quiet Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Flash Cannon
- Wide Guard / Shadow Sneak
- King's Shield
Notice how the Smogon set advises Gyro Ball (Steel Physical) and Shadow Ball (Ghost Special). Notice how the VGC set advises Shadow Ball (Ghost Special), Flash Cannon (Steel Special), and pinch Shadow Sneak (Ghost Physical). Sassy and Quiet natures, because 1) fuck Speed and 2) fuck hurting any of your four other promotable stats here. Sassy on the Smogon set because it's a defensive build; Quiet on the VGC set because it's an offensive build.

You'll find popular physical-only and special-only sets in both the XYORAS and SMUSUM eras, first of which is that very VGC2018 set we just posted (which, if you opt for Wide Guard over Shadow Sneak, immediately becomes a purely special attacking set). But notice how the mixed set is by no means excluded from consideration. How it is, in fact, foremost in Smogon's consideration. And that again is because we have to consider the opponent merely switching out their active Pokémon for a choice answer to our selected attacking stat. "Oh, your Aegislash is purely special? Say hello to Blissey." "Oh, your Aegislash is purely physical? Say hello to (whatever is most relevant right now in Gen 7)." Of course there are also walls with mixed coverage, like Toxapex and Celesteela, but our consideration right now is how you can best give yourself an advantage / how you can best remove yourself from a position of disadvantage. And with Aegislash, going mixed is a perfectly valid approach. You're not using Speed anyway. So you may as well make Speed the damaged stat, leave Atk/SpAtk alone, and then primarily strike foes with one of the two stats while secondarily striking them with the other.

To be clear, Shadow Sneak on VGC Aegislash is much more about picking off Pokémon who just barely avoided being KO'd last turn and is much less about actually doing any significant physical damage. But again, we have Smogon's truly mixed set in Gyro Ball and Shadow Ball, so ...

tl;dr your investigation is coming from a good place and there are definitely tons of Pokémon with dead-weight base stats, but you have to be careful not to generalize that Pokémon with super high Atk and SpAtk stats are always packing dead weight. Because there are Pokémon who run mixed sets. And some of them do so precisely because of their naturally high Atk and SpAtk base stats. Stats so high they can't be rightly ignored.
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