View Single Post
Old 04-13-2017, 02:40 AM   #27
Doppleganger's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Yukinomiya City, Fukushima Prefecture
Posts: 12,423
Send a message via AIM to Doppleganger
Originally Posted by Shuckle View Post
1. Most people on UPN are part of more than 1 section of the forum. We're a tighter-knit community than "Customers of a given video game."
Rule of law, not rule of cliques, is how to run community. Or else people will find you unapproachable and rather than risk hostility, they'll keep their opinions to themselves. Not much of a community if nobody is willing to talk to one another.

*cough* Debate Forum *cough*

Originally Posted by Shuckle View Post
2. If you cheat in StarCraft, you will be banned from StarCraft. It's not like being banned from SCII gives you free reign to cheat on any other Blizzard game. Clean Slate = Second Chance.
This doesn't make any sense. A second chance is getting another shot at playing StarCraft II, not moving to an entirely different game.

Regardless of the guidance, warnings and indigence toward Aposteriori, nothing speaks louder than punishment, and the first punishment (as I am lead to believe) was a permanent ban from PASBL. There was no opportunity for what I see as an "honest" second chance. If anything, the ban may have been incentive for retaliation in the form of FB abuse. Illegal alts are almost always registered by a revenge-motivated individual.

Hence why the "temp ban" from the forum was largely useless. Aposteriori was banned from parts of the forum he never frequented, and then when he came back he was still permabanned from PASBL. How can you say Aposteriori learned his lesson when you took away his opportunity to show what he learned?

Originally Posted by Shuckle View Post
3. Blizzard has a financial incentive to allow cheaters to play other games, and it doesn't make sense that a cheater wouldn't be allowed to play a game they bought just because they cheated in another, mostly unrelated game. UPN has no such conflict of interest.
Blizzard can't prove that one license violator is the same person playing on another license, since it's one account/IP. You could have a family of 5 using the same computer to play different games. All you could prove was the license-violating offenses. So the TOS apply only to the license, not the license-holder (who is unknown).

It isn't about a financial incentive to cheaters. See: the history of Diablo on and how that lead to the creation of the ladder and Blizzard's vast anti-cheat infrastructure.

UPN clearly thinks the TOS is agreed with the user, not the account, hence the justification behind banning alts. But agreeing to the TOS to post on the forum is not the same as agreeing to PASBL's rules to play there, so being banned from PASBL should likewise not extend back to the forum-level TOS (let alone FB's) unless Aposteriori was also violating the TOS alongside PASBL's rules.

I feel like I'm repeating myself now, so I'll just quote myself:

Originally Posted by Doppleganger
The proper courses of action were: a permanent forum-wide ban (most severe), a Clubs & Social Projects subforum ban (moderate severity) or a long temp ban with the option to return to PASBL (least severe).

#2 makes the most sense because FB should not have accepted players who got themselves permanently banned from PASBL. If you are Canada, do you accept an immigrant with a murder/rape conviction in the US? If they could not clean up their act in the game they were already vested in, why would they do so in a new one?

Jeri's ultimate choice was pretty much the worst option. The main forum loses a potential contributor, FB was terrorized, and the banned posters received inconsistent treatment regarding their transgressions in different RP which sets a bad precedent as it moves the ban into vaguer discretionary authority.
Note that I am not in favour of #3, but consider it fairer to everyone (Aposteriori included) than #2. In the #3 scenario, Aposteriori never goes to FB, and it is a true second chance where he either opts for revenge (and we quickly proceed to option #1) or reforms and keeps his PASBL gains.
今 信じあえる
あきらめない 心かさね
Doppleganger is offline