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Old 10-25-2012, 09:40 AM   #72
Double Dragon
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,585
Before you read this post, I would like it to be known that I do not advocate pedophilia in any way. Any attempts to accuse me of that are completely unwarranted, and will be met with strong denial and a complete loss of respect for you. I respect the decisions of Kuno, Jeri, and the rest who made the decision, but this is just my personal viewpoint on the matter.

Well, I don't necessarily agree with UM's banning forum-wide, but I understand why it was done. Personally, I think a temporary debate forum ban should have been made for some amount of time with a "this is your last warning" label attached (more on that later). True, he did express some views supporting pedophilia, however I believe those were in the "what if" context from a political point of view, rather than him actually desiring children. In addition to the quote about him not minding having a child bride should the opportunity be presented, the only other quote that I could find on the matter that I thought was iffy at all was:

Originally Posted by unownmew
I agree. Though African and middle eastern tribes may go by actual physical maturity, I agree an arbitrary age is the best choice for a law. What we disagree on, is what that age ought to be. It is my belief that such arbitrary age be 12, as it has most commonly been in human history, though, no doubt you wouldn't be satisfied with anything less than 18.
However, again, I think that this is just his political point of view, and that he would never actually pursue children. He certainly gave me no reason to believe that he was actually a pedophile, and the quotes brought up against him just show me a person stating his beliefs, even though they are unpopular. Though I do understand why the banning would take place, just as a precautionary measure. I just wish this had not been the final straw. He never said anything along the lines of desiring children, only that if the opportunity presented itself, he would be fine with child brides as long as an abuse of trust had not taken place. For example:

Originally Posted by unownmew
If sexual relations were to occur in a mutually approved and lawfully recognized marriage, in a loving manner, treating the young spouse as an equal rather than an object of self-satisfaction, I would fully support them.
To wrap up that point, I really don't feel that unownmew was actually a pedophile, just stating his political beliefs. Besides, to bring up Rangeet's point, anything that Mozz says is much worse than what unownmew said about pedophilia in my opinion, even if we know he's just joking.

That being said, I do understand the outrage over the anti-gay hate speech. If anything, I think that should have been the reason behind a ban more than anything else. I believe that a Debate Forum ban for an arbitrary amount of time would have been appropriate for his comments about homosexuals. They went far beyond just not supporting gay marriage, but showed that he felt that homosexuals are second class citizens, which is just inexcusable in my books. That is why I felt that he deserved a Debate Forum ban for a while, instead of just a forum-wide ban. Unownmew showed that he kept his views to the Debate Forum only. Heck, I even enjoyed interacting with him when everyone was on the Yu-Gi-Oh! kick a while back. Had he been given a big warning like that telling him to tone it down on the anti-gay speech, I feel that he would have been intelligent enough to respect that warning and stop. However, upon his hypothetical return, he would have been kept on a very short leash.

One final point about hate speech: in my mind a double standard has certainly been set here. I'm not going to quote anyone directly here because I wouldn't want to offend them, but here me out. True, unownmew spoke out against homosexuals. However, there were more than a few posts that were completely off topic basically telling him to get out, or fuck off, or just completely berating him, or something else. I remember these posts were made by completely different types of people too, from relative newbies to people who have been a part of UPN for a long time. To me, these off-topic hate posts are just as bad as unownmew's anti-gay speech. Those people deserve a temporary ban from the Debate Forum as well, in my opinion. I think there should be a no tolerance policy when it comes to hate speech in the debate forum, no matter who says it about whom. By banning unownmew with one of the reasons being his hate speech, but not giving a forum ban or even a Debate Forum ban to other offenders, I feel that a double standard is being set. If warnings were given to people other than unownmew, I did not know about them, and I apologize for the accusation of setting a double standard.

Again, even though I don't really agree with what went down as far as discipline goes, I still do respect the decisions that were made, and the people who made them. Hope I gave some food for thought here.

Last edited by phoopes; 10-25-2012 at 09:42 AM.
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