Thread: Signature Moves
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Old 05-11-2016, 12:56 AM   #37
Shuckle
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Land of Thought and Melody
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If you want to take a x4 to x0, you must pick up at least one other weakness.

This should be x1 ;p

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6) Entry Hazards
Entry hazard can only have a single effect, be it damage, a status, a boost or drop or a similar effect. They must be clearable by conventional hazard clearing moves and be directly targetable and destroyable by moves of good or greater damage.


I don't really like the idea that entry hazards can't do damage and have a boost or status at the same time. Perhaps only up to two effects, and the effects must be weaker, compromised, or conditional?

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11) New Moves
New moves can be created. The simplest new move, a re-type or edit of an existing move, will generally be passable without much issue. However, certain high power moves, such as Hyper Beam, or moves with unique, guaranteed or potent effects, such as Zap Cannon, may be more difficult to pass. Moves must generally use at least as much energy as they deal damage in most cases. However, moves with unique, guaranteed or potent effects may need to be inefficient (for example, moves guaranteed to deal a certain status should be inefficient). New moves may only have one effect beyond damage, be it lowering a stat, inflicting a status, or some other unique effect, without needing higher energy, though having the ability to have multiple effects must increase the energy use. Additionally, the effects must not stack - that is, there can only be one effect triggered by a single use. Moves with multiple effects may only have 3 possible effects. The more likely an effect is to trigger, the more energy inefficient the move should be. Moves with 10%-15% chance to have a secondary effect do not need to be inefficient, but moves with a 20% chance or higher should require more energy. Damaging moves can be two types which you can freely choose from or may use two types simultaneously. New moves may also be of types your Pokémon does not normally have access to or typeless.


Where do non-damaging moves fit?

I don't really like having guidelines around for new moves. They're kinda known for being weird, so IMO trying to control the way they are approved on anything more than a case-by-case basis isn't a good idea. With that said, it's a good guideline that should cover the simple use cases (I want a move that does damage and has an effect, which will help cover my weaknesses, either the pokemon's weaknesses or my own playstyle weaknesses).

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While rough guidelines may be a good things to encourage, rules I feel impede creativity. And rulesets like this pushes sigs from being art to being science, balanced equations, boxes checked. That's not good. That's something I have had issue with in ASB, especially lately: we're losing the art. Everything's all math and exact percentages and formula and decimals and all that. You take the art out of ASB and we may as well be Smogon ASB. And maybe not this change specifically, but this attitude behind this change, this is what's smothering the art.
Strongly disagree. Oftentimes, rules ENCOURAGE creativity. It can be hard to "write about anything," but if you ask a group of people to "write about news stories that you think would be relevant to turtles," you'd probably get a lot of really interesting and creative ideas. I get what you're saying, that codified rules allow people to analyze and compute the best or most efficient kinds of sigs...but these rules already existed. They're just being written down as a guide to sig writing.

Plus, the un-codified system has a bunch of inconsistencies and cheating that obscured the way the rules actually worked and made things aggravating - why can Talon's Parasect get 4 good offensive moves just because he gave up Stun Spore and Spore, when my Parasect can't get 3 average offensive moves when giving up X-Scissor, Mega Drain, and Toxic?

Also, not everyone is as good at mentally balancing sigs as you are. Some of us (COUGH COUGH) have really cool and creative sig ideas but aren't capable of phrasing or balancing them in a way that pleases the LOs. Or the rest of the PASBL, apparently :/ The system of "needs a drawback/doesn't need a drawback" is confusing as fuck and it can be difficult for newcomers to understand what makes a good sig or a not-drawbacky-enough sig or an impermissible sig (rip my necromancer shedinja from 2011 ;-; was literally fine but had a little cosmetic staff for using her sig move).
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