The Sexism Double Standard

[Talon87]

I don't really want to launch a debate about feminism, sexism, etc per se, but I do want to share this video I just found and I imagine that, after the regulars offer their replies (or maybe even *as* they offer their replies) to the video, someone will surely come along and turn the conversation towards why they are a feminist or why they are an anti-feminist and, in anticipation of such a shitstorm ;-), I'll go ahead and post this thread in the debate section for now. Feel free to move it to the Misc section if you really disagree with the decision, Kuno.

It's Only Sexist When Men Do It (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JA4EPRbWhQ) - WARNING: 18+ for coarse language and graphic topics
EDIT: I should point out, he uses "the 'c' word" quite a bit, which I can only imagine he's doing to prove a point. But ladies, if you're easily offended by such overt sexism, I completely understand. My advice? Treat the opening bit of his tirade the same way you would a vulgar stand-up comedian's warm-up. Give him at least two minutes of your time before turning him off if his word usage is that bothersome.

In this video uploaded July 22, 2011, a Youtuber who goes by the name TheAmazingAtheist rails against sexist women who find funny circumstances which, were the gender roles reversed, they would find worthy of the worst punishments permissible under our laws. I thought this was a very good video, if a little vulgar and at times a little close-minded (like all those attacks against "Iran" when most Iranians don't think the way he suggested they do). He hits on a very good point that the double standard is unacceptable and that either everything's able to be laughed about or else none of it is. I'll disclaim that I don't know the details behind the first two criminal cases he cited (the penile amputation story and then the shotgun-to-the-head story) so I don't know to what extent, if any, he's putting a positive spin on things.

As for the male robber who got imprisoned and raped for three days by the female shopkeeper ... all I gotta say is, people write stories just like his counter-example (male shopkeeper abducts, rapes female shoplifter) for others to get off on, stories that show up in magazines available for purchase in physical stores, so I dunno that he's gonna win the entire male vote on that story. At least not in Akihabara. ^^;

EDIT2: A friend writes to me, "Assuming you don't know who that is. While he's correct, he's one of the worst people in the world." Disclaimer: I have no idea who this guy is. Never seen him before in my life. Is he a rapist? Is he the world's biggest asshole? Is he a chauvinist dirtbag? I have no idea. All I know is, I felt he did a good job of pointing out at least three cases where female society feels it's okay to laugh but if the roles were reversed female society would be appalled, i.e. three examples of the sexism double standard that so many men and women find appalling.

[Tyranidos]

You can write a story about whatever you want, it doesn't make it any less wrong :x

[Talon87]

That's kind of an ambiguous post. What are you referring to as being wrong?

[Tyranidos]

I mean like, morally wrong. You said in your post that "people write stories just like his counter-example (male shopkeeper abducts, rapes female shoplifter) for others to get off on, stories that show up in magazines available for purchase in physical stores." The fact that rape is written about doesn't make it a moral action.

[Talon87]

Oh no, of course not. I was just joking that the Youtuber, rather than get the expected result of both genders agreeing that the actions depicted in the original news story were not appropriate, might be surprised to discover that a subset of men in Akihabara would actually join hands with the laughing women in saying, "You know ... that news story is a pretty funny example of taking matters into your own hands and dishing out street justice. :lol:"

[Tyranidos]

Oh. Alright then.

In any case, I thought it was a pretty cool video. Sharon Osbourne is a huge bitch.

[Doppleganger]

"This bitch robbed my store, so I raped her for three days!"

Oh man, how funny it was to hear that delivery. Great video.

I agree with the guy's observation, but not that "if women can be vulgar/insensitive, men can be vulgar/insensitive"! Men aren't allowed to make jokes about battering women because it's crude, hateful and celebrates domestic violence. This is partially reinforced by stereotypes of women as fragile and dependent, but it's still pretty bad when applied to men too, even with their stereotype of "men being tough".

Women shouldn't be allowed to make jokes about that. If they find them funny, I see their amusement being rooted in those culturally re-inforced stereotypes of women being weak, and men being strong. The idea of a women turning the tables in such an over-the-top way struck her as hysterical, to the point of dismissing the plea of that other women who offered some sense.

I don't find any of those assault/battery stories funny, whether they involve men and men or women and men. I did remember finding the Russian rape story funny, but mostly because it had so many quirky elements to it, like the woman paying the guy for his service. But that didn't mean the women wasn't a monster who tortured a man, even if he tried to rob her.

Maybe I'm laughing at the same thing as the women...but I don't find 99% of these stories funny. It would have to be Ripley's Believe It Or Not-level sensational for me to find it funny.

[Mozz]

Rape is pretty funny, you guys.

[Holy Emperor]

I've seen all those videos. I think. I don't remember if they are the same ones. They were pretty good.

[big bad birtha]

I don't think society's view on it should matter that much. Sure, it's annoying that they have a double standard like that, but it's not like that's going to change anytime soon. If a joke is funny, it's funny. If it isn't, it isn't. People who mindlessly follow society's morals shouldn't ruin that for you. I'll give an example.

If I say the following joke to someone: "Yeah, this girl told me that she was raped last night. I comforted her by saying "What a coincidence! I raped someone last night!"" and if the person goes "That's wrong." it just means I won't tell jokes to that person again....or I'll be flooding those kinds of jokes at the person if he/she pisses me off.

Most of the people I've told that joke to have given me a good reaction to it.

[Jerichi]

I originally was going to comment on the theme of the thread but...

As for the male robber who got imprisoned and raped for three days by the female shopkeeper ... all I gotta say is, people write stories just like his counter-example (male shopkeeper abducts, rapes female shoplifter) for others to get off on, stories that show up in magazines available for purchase in physical stores, so I dunno that he's gonna win the entire male vote on that story. At least not in Akihabara. ^^;

I... really don't think that should matter.

Porn is fantasy. Porn is not supposed to equate with actual, real-life situations. And if it does to you, you have something wrong with you. Desire to inflict or even see real mental or emotional pain, especially sexualization of it, is indication of a sick, twisted mind.

I don't really care who you are, but if you have some moral fibre, you would be against rape in any form, at least overtly. Liking porn that simulates rape (and even openly admitting it)? I mean, it's borderline, but acceptable as long as you aren't injuring someone in the process. But being in support of or even neutral towards it shows you're either wildly insensitive or just plain fucked up.

[Talon87]

I... really don't think that should matter.

Porn is fantasy. Porn is not supposed to equate with actual, real-life situations. And if it does to you, you have something wrong with you. Desire to inflict or even see real mental or emotional pain, especially sexualization of it, is indication of a sick, twisted mind.

I don't really care who you are, but if you have some moral fibre, you would be against rape in any form, at least overtly. Liking porn that simulates rape (and even openly admitting it)? I mean, it's borderline, but acceptable as long as you aren't injuring someone in the process. But being in support of or even neutral towards it shows you're either wildly insensitive or just plain fucked up.
Is this a personal attack or a general attack? :? Is this a personal question or a rhetorical question? Asking because I'd rather not spend the next hour having to defend myself from a personal attack that was never launched. I'll throw this out there for now though: a sample from June 04, 2007:
I can think of no more horrific crime than rape, as it is so psychologically ruinous to the victim (sometimes irreversibly so) and is a true case of sick bastards giving some credence to the horrible theory of "Might Makes Right."
Believe me when I say that I don't think you'll find someone more appalled by real-life rape here than me. In past discussions on the board (sadly lost to time, it seems), I've been the lone dissenting voice who believes that being raped can sometimes be a crueler fate than being murdered, i.e. rape has the possibility of transforming a good life into a miserable life whereas murder can do nothing more than to end a life, i.e. to render the good neutral. It cannot make bad that which it ends, even if being ended is in and of itself a terrible thing. Most people would say "better to live miserably than to not live at all. Ergo, murder worse than rape." I tend to disagree. I do value life, obviously, or else I wouldn't be doing what I do. But I believe rape can be one of the single most transformative events, for the worse, in the lives of some of its victims. And that the luckiest victims are those for whom it is not such a negatively transformative experience but for whom the pain is transient. Yet for many, the mental scars of rape can last a lifetime. And that, I think, is why it is truly such a horrible crime.

Anyway, there go 15 minutes. Would rather not spend more time, like I said, unless this was a personal attack.

[Doppleganger]

Jeri's just speaking in general, using the generic "you" instead of "one".